people like being shit on

what better than QL?

it's probably 50,000+ because it got featured on hardocp.com

i think its over 9000

I've pointed out the number inflation that id has done for a while, but I think this could be a simple bug.

Many times, people's queue froze up, or they're impatient, or they accidentally close the browser. That being the case, it seems more like the system simply doesn't remove your spot from the queue when you leave, and adds you to the end as well. A few refreshes from the same person, and a lot of people doing it, and you end up with a mess of a queue. This would explain why your queue goes down by hundreds at a time - it quickly weeds through the dead connections and throws the next real person in.

There were a few unanswered questions as to why everyone had the queue spot ending in a 20/80/etc almost as if it was counting individuals as 10 people, but the queue has been serviced a few times when it broke down, and it now displays a more likely number.

yeah and they really didn't get 115,000 serperate accounts within 8 hours of the release, must just be lies to make them look good.

everything i read from you seems to be some kind of a conspiracy with whatever you have going on in the moment. you need to not hate the world and accept things as they are.

I was waiting for this argument. Here, go look yourself (if you can get through the queue LOLOL):

gg
Create an account and complete a match against Crash.

* Date awarded: 02/24/2009
* No friends have earned this award
* 33519 players (100% of total) have earned this award

115,000 eh? Why do the numbers never support the claims?

Hell, let's make it look even worse:

Testing One..Two..
Complete 1 online match.

* No friends have earned this award
* 16933 players (51% of total) have earned this award

So... what... less than 33% of people who "apparently" signed up got past crash... and for the ones that did, only 50% of them have even played a game.

* 33519 players (100% of total) have earned this award
115,000 eh?

To be fair, you could argue that there's 115,000 registered accounts, but the rest have either yet to play the Crash Match, found out it's not supported by their OS or Browser, or maybe it didn't install correctly.

Why not just offer unbloated statistics? Instead, they just continue to have that "oh there's x reason you aren't seeing the rest" like every time.

Blizzard does the same thing.

"12 MILLION ACCOUNTS"

Yet, 6-8 million are technically 'active'.

You don't see anyone else attacking their marketing department.

Yet, 6-8 million are technically 'active'.

What? Where are you getting these numbers?

I believe it's possible (and people attack them on inflating numbers all the time) but how does that change anything? You're basically just saying "Other companies are just as scummy." Trust me, I don't defend the WoW division of Blizzard - they're mostly just old EQ developers anyway.

add 80.000 to 33.000, what do you get?

Cause I think 80.000 was the number of closed beta accounts, wasn't it?
Sure it would be somewhat of a marketing stunt to count those, as well. But technically they are accounts.

If only you were as creative in looking for argumants for both sides and not just the nagetive ones...

I'm pretty sure they said they purged all accounts that weren't used in the last 28 days. You mean for me to believe that they already had 80,000 accounts and that they weren't prepared for 33,000 more? Doesn't add up. I already tried to consider that view point. =/

they obiuosly were prepared for 33.000 more or else they wouldn't be a list of "gg" awards.
However it seems they were not prepared for 33.000 in a single day.

But then how could 80,000 survive the purge?

they drank a potion of immunity of course

I'm pretty sure there were quite a few people like me who played one match the day before the purge to keep the account

You didn't have to play - just log in.

They interrupted the spellcast.

seriously, though it could just be that the number is still in some database and wasn't reset when the beta was opened.
Again, I'm not saying the gave out the correct numbers, but I just doubt they simply made something up.

I've been pointing out number inflation for a while, so why would this be any different? Also, were you in the closed beta? To even think that 80,000 people tried to save their account is just impossible. That number seems a bit big, as well. After Quakecon, they were up to 10,000 - 5,000 of which were FROM quakecon.

so because you tried to make a point a while ago, this has to be the same?
Nice circle logic imo.

oh and no I don't think it's inflation, I don't even think that term would fit at all. Or are the players becoming worth less or something?

and please read carefully, I did not say that everyone tried to save the account. just the e.g. the counter wasn't reset when accounts were deleted.

so because you tried to make a point a while ago, this has to be the same?
Nice circle logic imo.

If their marketing division decided to do it in the past, why wouldn't they do it now? I only had third party information and information that was defended through "you just can't see xx for xx reason" that was a problem, but now I show you the same pattern but with direct proof, and it's somehow not related?

oh and no I don't think it's inflation, I don't even think that term would fit at all. Or are the players becoming worth less or something?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=define%3Ainflation

and please read carefully, I did not say that everyone tried to save the account. just the e.g. the counter wasn't reset when accounts were deleted.

So are you saying it was an accident, or that they inflated the numbers like I said?

edit: Also, I'd like to see the source of that 80,000 accounts that you brought up. You'll be hard pressed to convince me that it was even that high after barely pushing 10,000 at Quakecon in August.

<SyncError|away> The 113k was correct.
<SyncError|away> The issue is that most of our users have not yet completed the training
<SyncError|away> due to the slow authorization emails and entry queue
<SyncError|away> The awards only take in account the players who have passed training and started to play online.
<SyncError|away> We currently have about 55k that have played online to begin earning awards
<SyncError|away> up from what was bout 35k when you took notice.

I believe it as much as I believe he knows how to balance the weapons in Q3... that is...

you're avoiding the fact that it makes sense

Again, I'll believe it when I see it.

Now you're bringing up something completely unrelated? You can't acknowledge the fact that the numbers are right, so you post his weapon stats?

Who cares, he's not directly in-charge of weapon balance. If you'd talk to him one on one, you'd find out.

You can't acknowledge the fact that the numbers are right, so you post his weapon stats?

Again, there is NO proof that the "numbers are right." The only proof that we have lies in direct contrast to the numbers given. This is recurring pattern, yet you refuse to accept it. The weapon stats seem to be about on par with how much he knows about Quake.

Who cares, he's not directly in-charge of weapon balance. If you'd talk to him one on one, you'd find out.

Did you even read his posts in the closed beta forum? I spoke to him in PM for almost 2 hours on quakenet many months ago.

You're still trying to argue that since his weapon accuracy stats suck, he shouldn't have a decision or be in charge of the weapon damage numbers for QL.

I'm going to design a rocket that goes from here to mars. I don't really know the distance between us, or the rate at which fuel is consumed, but I can always throw more rockets at it until it works.

I suck at soccer, but I'm going to pick a good soccer team from my experience watching the game, playing it, and understanding the mechanics and balance in the game.

I suck at CS, but I can understand the advanced concepts, strategies, and gameplay, and if it needed to be balance, I could still give credible opinion.

No matter how much you try to understand it as a third party, you simply can't until you've done it yourself. I can explain to you that writing a computer program is simply feeding it instructions line by line, but that doesn't mean that you understand how it works or how to do it.

I don't think you understand quite how bad 17% is, but your arguments make me expect that you aren't far off yourself.

Err, what?

God I hate you so much Gills. You can't beat people. Srsly.

nice you beat a newbie who plays on a laptop sitting on a floor with major delayed input from the keyboard

niiiiiiiice

LG whore

tom's stats pretty much speak for themself on that one.

Anyway, here's a little update for you about a week after release..

Accounts listed now:
* 165217 players (100% of total) have earned this award

Players who have completed even 1 online match now:
* 16933 players (10% of total) have earned this award

Note that the number of players who have played an online match... HASN'T CHANGED by even 1 since I posted about it. Now, I'm sure you'll like to argue that this is a bug (and it could be!), but then why is the GG achievement still going up? If there is a bug, one could also argue that the GG achievement is listing incorrect numbers. Why do all of id's stats stop working when I point them out?

Stats are disabled, and have been for a while.

So one is staying the same, and a few others went up... but stats are disabled...

Again, why do they stop working when I point them out?

Your worse than Michael Moore on the US Government.

Your worse than Michael Moore on the US Government.

*You're

When Quake Live fails, I'll be back here to let you know just how wrong you were.

all stats have been disabled except for the GG award you get for playing Crash. They disabled the stats because some people weren't getting their match against Crash ranked, so they devoted all their logging resources to ensure people could at least get past the training. So you can't use those stats as any sort of indicator for how many people are playing. I myself have played something like 15-20 duels but according to the profile i'm at 0 games.

You're becoming a bigger douchebag by the second.

Just wait until I push the millisecond barrier.

SyncError knows his stuff with balancing, don't you ever get tired of this unremitting dismissal of all things? It seems to be your ESR raison d'etre.

SyncError knows his stuff with balancing

Thank you for completely changing my mind.

oh god, please, use your brain. Accuracy comes and goes with playtime ratio. Knowledge stays.

The game hasn't been around long enough for accuracy to fade.

i belive you are a sc fan, yes?

i dont see any blizzard employees playing top games.

Blizzard employees did play at Blizzcon in SC, actually. There are several on the development cycle who are pretty good. That being said, I *do* agree that there are problems with the SC2. I feel SC was more a lucky moment like QW was for id, and I'm afraid that they might ruin the game.

playing in a tournament doesnt make you good though.

I don't disagree. Again, many people have issues with the direction of SC2. They are taking advice directly from the professionals, but it's still too early to see how much is being ignored.

what about sc1?

http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1665857#pid1665857

http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1665921#pid1665921

Is there a question that I haven't answered already? That link has your answer about SC1.

so you're saying that blizzard has no idea how to balance a game and their game (which they perfected over what, 10 years?) is balanced because of luck?

I'm saying that it's the most likely case. Look at every other product that they have produced. I don't know enough about their history of patching, but I'd be happy to find out that they simply listened to the top players for the balance tweaks. Recent tweaks to WoW and the Activision merge suggest otherwise. =/

Don't forget what SyncError's job actually is.

about inflation, since English is not my first language I am always eager to learn. Which of the definitions in your link were you going for?

# a general and progressive increase in prices; "in inflation everything gets more valuable except money"
# (cosmology) a brief exponential expansion of the universe (faster than the speed of light) postulated to have occurred shortly after the big bang
# ostentation: lack of elegance as a consequence of being pompous and puffed up with vanity
# the act of filling something with air
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

# Inflation is a rise in the general level of prices of goods and services over time. "Inflation" is also sometimes used to refer to a rise in the prices of some specific set of goods or services, as in "commodities inflation" or "core inflation". ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation

# In physical cosmology, cosmic inflation is the idea that the universe passed through a phase of exponential expansion that was driven by a ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation_(cosmology)

# An act, instance of, or state of expansion or increase in size, especially by injection of a gas; A increase in the general level of prices or in ...
en.wiktionary.org/wiki/inflation

# inflationary - associated with or tending to cause increases in inflation; "inflationary prices"
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

# The general rise in prices across the economy over a year.
www.tescofinance.com/personal/finance/finance/loans/glossary.html

# a persistent, substantial rise in the general level of prices related to an increase in the volume of money and resulting in the loss of value of currency
en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Macroeconomics/Glossary

# The rate at which the general level of prices for goods and services is rising
www.cityindex.co.uk/learn_to_trade/glossary.aspx

# An overall increase in the general price level. Where inflation is rising, even though some prices may fall, the overall cost of living and cost of business rises because most prices increase. The rate of inflation is the percentage change (usually annualised) in a price level index. ...
www.financial-guide.net/glossary.php

# no more than 1.5% above the average inflation rate of the lowest 3 inflation countries in the EU
www.bized.co.uk/virtual/economy/library/glossary/

# increase in the overall level of prices in an economy.
www.geocities.com/efrajovel/glossdebt.htm

# The rise in price of goods and services, or Consumer Price Index (CPI), when too much money chases too few goods on the market. Moderate inflation is a result of economic growth. ...
www.zacks.com/help/glossary/

# The rate of change in the prices of consumer goods. Usually, inflation is measured by the Consumer Price Index for All Urban Consumers, which is computed monthly by the US Department of Labor.
www.cbtfinancial.com/clearfield/cms/program/content/65.php

# The gradual reduction of the purchasing power of the dollar, usually related directly to the increase in the money supply by the federal government.
www.mymoneyinc.com/terms.html

# Increasing price levels. A loss in the purchasing power of money. When a dollar today is worth more than that dollar tomorrow.
www.calgary-alberta-real-estate-listings.com/i/i1.html

# Continued rise in the general price level in conjunction with a related drop in purchasing power. Sometimes referred to as an excessive movement in such price levels.
www.fx-forex-trading.com/glossary.htm

# The number of dollars in circulation exceeds the amount of goods and services available for purchase; inflation results in a decrease in the ...
www.lenderratematch.com/en/glossary/

# Inflation occurs when there is more money available than there are goods and services to be purchased. Mortgage rates, which are determined by the marketplace and the actions of the Federal Reserve Board and Wall Street, are sensitive to inflation fears.
www.foreclosurewarehouse.com/glossary/glossaryi.php

# An economic condition whereby prices for consumer goods rise, eroding purchasing power.
www.forex-leader.com/glossary.aspx

# A rapid, accelerating expansion occuring in the early universe in some cosmological models, which solves several problems of cosmology.
www.cpepweb.org/main_universe/glossary.html

# Short period of unchecked cosmic expansion early in the history of the universe. During inflation, the universe swelled in size by a factor of about 1050.
physics.fortlewis.edu/astronomy/astronomy%20today/chaisson/GLOSSARY/GLOSS_I.HTM

# is the rise in the general level of prices. This is equivalent to a fall in the value or purchasing power of money. It is the opposite of deflation.
www.encyclopedia4u.com/i/inflation-1.html

# The declining value of money due to rising prices.
www.metlife.com/Applications/Corporate/WPS/CD...38,00.html

# general increase in prices for goods and services in an economy over time Interest Rate - the fee that is charged by the lender of the mortgage, it is set by the fee that the Federal Reserve charges the banks Mortgage - a loan in which the amount borrowed is the difference between the cost of ...
home-mortgage.asia/glossary.html

# A sustained increase in the general level of prices so that a given amount of money buys less and less. ...
www.xinc.net.au/finance_dictionary/i.html

# a brief and extraordinarily rapid period of expansion a fraction of a second after the Big Bang
www.langwood.thebox.net.nz/eshop/pages.php

# The overall upward movement of the cost of goods and services.
www.knowledgedynamics.com/demos/Breakeven/GlossaryMain.htm

# A persistent tendency in the economy when prices and money wages are on the rise. Inflation is measured by the proportional changes over time in ...
www.ibnlive.com/news/no-jargon-please/58091-27-single.html

# An increase in overall prices, which leads to a decrease in purchasing power
www.developmenteducation.ie/glossary/

# A modification of Big Bang theory which proposes that the infant Universe went through a very brief period of extremely rapid expansion. Inflation suggests that the Universe is vastly larger than its observable part.
www.amnh.org/sciencebulletins/astro/f/sdss.20.../index.php

# the act of filling something with air

always thought that definition was strictly literally, except for the few idioms like "inflated ego" :/

oh, well.

seriously, wtf is wrong with you?

on the discussion:

I would rather say it was an oversight than an accident, but yeah I don't think it was just a made up figure either way.

And so far your "direct proof" has consisted of repeating something someone alledgedly said to you. So it's not a bit better that what pl4gue posted. I think he term is "hearsay".

Repeating what that was said to me? Allegedly? I've given you numbers directly from the site - go look yourself (if you can get through the queue!). The proof I've had in the past has not been as strong, granted, but this is directly from their database.

you were taling about the past argument and so was I.

The queue. Several people mentioned that it wasn't working correctly at the start, and I'm sure nobody is going to defend it's accuracy right now.

By zerg Vedic +++| - Reply to #23
I've been pointing out number inflation for a while, so why would this be any different?

...and?

actually it's the number of slap in the face the guy who decided to use flash for ql's site should eat

There has been lots of publicity - sites like the bbc news covering it could certainlytrigger tens of thousands of people to take a look.

It was the 4th most read BBC article yesterday when I looked.

everyone got multi accounts, dont we?

yes, because sitting in queue is just sooooooo much fun :)

HERES AN IDEA

Instead of waiting 3 hours in a queue. Why not work for those 3 hours and use the money you earned to buy Quake 3 and not have to wait around in a fucking queue.

I am basically doing that, except i work on a presentation while I am in queue. :P

(and spamming esr o/c)

Get Ultimate Quake instead. It's $20 but you get all 3.

but then i can't work and spam :(

A true dilemma.

I was through the queue this morning, played and went to work. I came back turned on my computer and guess what. I am AGAIN in this !"§$%&/ queue.
So it can be useful to keep the ql browser window open and to keep your connection up.

You get logged out if youre inactive tolong

We currently have 8,500 players online and over 290,000 registered accounts

=)

Of which 200,000 will never be seen again

90.000 regular players is still pretty damn good for a fps.

The queue thing needs to go if QL is ever gonna be popular. Imagine all the people going to the site after reading about it on some news site, excited to try it, only to find out that they have to wait in a line to be able to play. Instant fail. People aren't gonna put up with that shit.

Of course this is just beta, so who knows.

thats soo True!!!

You would know if you read any of the releases
http://www.quakelive.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11816

I need a delorean

deloreans doesn't work that way

what you say ?

He means a delorean won't do you any good. What you really need is a flux compensator, which you could put in a volvo, although of course you'd lose points on style.

not worth it without it, that's just ql
I should have written "I need that delorean" (and that's the flying one)

Thank your stars there are not a lot of us Africans in front of you in the queue :PPPP

sif you have computers

Oh please, my supercomputer runs on 12 pack donkeys turning a turbine to generate its power! Which first world computer does than?!