just remove intervention shit nub crouchers railer sger map

Here's my vote:
Tornado.
Dreadful Place.
Grim Dungeons.
Hidden Fortress.
Purgatory.

Four new (new to me means not from q3) maps and one all-time classic that still works. Lots of powerups and it gets rid of maps that are nowhere near as good as they were in quake 3.

i completely agree with this pool for the time being. but i dont know which i would remove in the case our map gets in etcetc, obviously im biased since i want our map to be in the future pool :D

if we get quality maps in the future, pool of 7 might be ok. atm we simply dont have enough good maps to have that though

dont think hf offers anything to the map pool that deep inside doesnt. it has an uninteresting quad area. it could be ok if one of the teles were removed. or both replaced by just one tele at the water corner between the 2 existing teles. but it still wouldnt be as good as deep inside imo.

and to reply to ur second comment. simple really, replace deep inside first, grim dungeons second. get rid of the q3 maps in tournaments.

Why adjust a popular map with pointless tele changes. Reminds me of the time somebody suggest 4mg damage, then to fix it said to just up it to 100 bullets.

The Quad area might not be that interesting to look at, but it allows quad to survive and for us to get 30 seconds of powerup play. Much better then some amazing looking quad area that is essentially a pit of death causing the quad to get fragged instantly and for the grand total of quad time spent on the map to not even match one single quad run on Hidden Fortress.

Deep Inside is a very different style of play to Hidden Fortress and there is room for both in the pool in my eyes. However Deep Inside is so old and overplayed now it really isn't as interesting to watch or play as it once was. Give it a break out the pool and rotate it back in again one day and people will be salivating over its inclusion.

not exactly sure how u draw those conclusions. i dont think the tele changes would be pointless. my big issue with the map as it is now is the fact that the teles take away any real positional disadvantage you get into by going for the items on the lower levels of the map. not only that, both teles give you a super easy way to go down, get the items and get to quad, meaning you can still get items that spawn like 5 seconds before quad and still have time to get to the quad itself. this takes a lot of decision making out of the game.

and i dont think the fact that the quad area allows the quad to survive is a valid defense of its design. i dont think you should ever have entertainment as the top priority while designing a map, although obviously it should be a desirable factor.

dont get me wrong, im not touting deep inside as the best map ever or anything. id love to see both deep inside and grim dungeons dropped in favor of good new maps. i just dont think hf is a good enough replacement for either.

How about removing both teleporters and adding a jumppad in the RL/YA room that goes to the 25hp bubble and adding a staircase in the RA room behind the 50hp bubble that goes up? Would make positional plays a lot stronger already i believe and remove the feeling that the map is super small.

could be worth testing either option. or 2 jumppads.

but its all well and good to talk about it, but unless u can work some magic on id i dont see any changes forthcoming. xD.

They did say they would like to make changes to dies irae to make it more enjoyable and have it in our official pool, though, did they not?
Now I am really looking forward to anyone coming in and telling about ALL the changes that dies irae would need. :P

5 is better, just rotate the poll season by season.

AGREE

That was exactly what i voted for as well.

I scrapped all the existing q3 maps other than Grim Dungeons simply because cess doesnt work and it gives teams the opportunity to play a more technical game if they wish.

Intervention is only ever picked by a select one or two teams (played once at DH says it all) and Deep Inside again, another q3 map which has been done to death and something has to give to make way for Tornado!

Grim Dungeons
Deep Inside
Purgatory
Tornado
Dreadful Place

2 old classics, 3 new

Perfect!! imo

this ^

DP
20
Purg
Torn
Grim

Just remove dm20.

see noctis for best maplist!

GJ + for you

aka williebobc ;]

I thought the same. dm20 seemed completely FFA lately, imo

sure its ffa, if you ready up without any pos, plan, idea

Every map is ffa if you don't know how to play it, isn't it?

try tdm on thunderstruck, would you say it wouldn't be ffa if you know "how to play it"?

Thunderstruck and many other maps aren't trying to be TDM maps, if you really needed someone to help you understand that, noctis, then I'm glad to help.

<noctan> im having a hard time imagining an inanimate map trying to be anything but an inanimate map
<noctan> its the players that put maps into categories
<noctan> and the map makers
<noctan> players could very well start calling it a tdm map
<noctan> kinda like they did with dm20

Yeah I know, a map like DM6, DM14, DM20 etc. was never specifically designed as being a TDM map, however, Thunderstruck was specifically designed for rocket arena/clan arena wasn't it? Therefore you shouldn't consider TDM on it, in the same way you shouldn't consider CTF maps being used for TDM.

Well then let me look for a better example if you are so hellbent to ignore my point with nitpicking. :)
How about Eviscerated (q3dm4) or hearth (q3dm3), they are even listed for TDM in quakelive and weren't made for ra3/ca.

Would it not be ffa on those maps if you know "how to play them"?

It goes away from my original point, which maybe wasn't clear, but even so I didn't think I'd get a response like "thunderstruck" to it. So I probably should have responded with this earlier instead. Any map, of the established and regularly played TDM maps, would be ffa if you didn't know how to play them.

lately?? sure it was even worse when the sg was powerful

i dont think dm20 is a good map but quite a few people seem to like playing it i fear
voted for the 5 noctis listed

ignore what noctis says, all his suggestions go wrong.

-Realm of Steel Rats -Tornado
+Limbus and frs map.

If ID brought those new maps before the start of the bigger fall leagues, so we could test them out in one or two one night cups, that would be awesome.

i will never understand the dm20 love

Says the guy who basically owned team France alone on it :)

Having played good on it doesn't automatically make me like it ...

I agree, i can't see why its so popular other than its just a full on +forward score insane damage map, there really isnt very much 'team' deathmatch involved.

Though a spectator might enjoy it more than others, watching high frag count quad runs is never boring for a viewer.

Seems no one likes realm of steel rats and intervention so far. This fact alone might be a good update for the current "official" map pool. At least we would then have only five maps instead of seven and could play with pick pick rather than drop drop pick pick, which sucks imo.

Perhaps go with the five that seem to be popular above and keep a reserve spot open for frs' map should it ever get released? :-)
it would still only be 5 possibly 6.

Realmofsteelrats and Intervention have had their day i think, and im saying this as a cpm4 lover, any suggestions to play it are met with severe groans on ts3, its even ek's home map, well it was!

The five that seem to be popular above? The vor-mappool or the noctis-mappool? :P
I think it's easy to have a little cup and then ask people if dies irae should be played or not, but with dm20 and osp5 there will always be a big bunch of people for each of them and against the other.
Luckily the poll will be closed on Monday afaik so I can use the results for Summer Cup III which will most likely be next Wednesday. Democracy ftw.

To be honest i'd be happy with either. I would favour vor's because its doing away with more of the old quake 3 maps.

I think grim dungeons still has something to offer as its unique in its style of play.

For Dies Irae you might want to try arrange few exhibition games on it or something to force people in to playing it? Might be worth considering anyway, it pretty much got overlooked in the last cup appart from the final?

Edit - Yay for another cup \o/

I'm all for new maps but imo Dies Irae does not work as it is right now.
I would like however, to encourage people to play it more and see if it's enjoyable or not. Encourage, not force. I think forcing people will do no good for the players mood, for the cup and it's popularity and for the map itself. For _encouraging_ them to give it a try I have yet to come up with an idea for one of the following cups. Suggestions are welcome :)

like ppl have ever in the history of ql/q3 started playing new maps when they werent forced upon them

So you want me to have a summer cup where the first map in each match HAS TO BE dies irae or how do you think we should _force_ people to like maps?
As I said I am not against it, I just think that hardly anyone would sign up for a cup like that.

that sounds like a good idea :P

Might as well have a summer cup where the only maps are Tornado, Dies Irae and Leviathan then. I think people would hate it. :P

This was my idea for a cup, but I had the same concern whether people would sign up or not, but it would be perfect for testing the maps.

what is wrong with ospdm6?
its just seems to me the map is being ignored and cant get it why?

simply noone enjoys playing it, can't be helped

I enjoy osp6 and think it plays much better in ql then in q3. Know quite a few who share same opinion.

read noone = big majority

Try playing team-rape on it and you will understand why, you get a free run of the map for twenty minutes while the four of them stand on the rg and ya spawn :-) no wonder people dislike it!

i played a lot on it in q3 and it was a great map. the better team wins usually, sometimes with huge difference its nothing new tho.

im sorry with a nick like that, i find it very very easy to ignore anything you say about tdm. xD.

Country: United States of America

i forgive you

it was a good(ish) map back in Q3, i didnt like it but i could see why others did, i dont think it plays well at all in QL however.

Bring in Leviathan!!!

I forgot about Leviathan. Wasn't it complete rubbish though? Afair there were a couple of tournaments with it when it first came out; felt like a ctf map without flags and the playstyle was absolutely linear with everyone trying to hold the RA room which made a team have RA and RL and advantagous position when attacking either of the two powerups.

nah nevermind that map, nobody other than me seems to like it

alpha was ok, but then there were improvements......

Results are online. I will use the first five maps for the next summer cup and make it pick pick format. Thanks for your votes!