there was a thread about this recently...

oh, i didnt see that, ill look into that. welp, i did, and hes apperantly a cheater. :p but i cant judge that.

Even though most people say its like mostly strafe aim and only very little mouse aim. so i dont see the reason why the sensitivity would affect your lg at all if you do like, lets say, 80% strafe "aim" and 20% mouse aim.

this is how u can make noobs say shits like this by decent mouse aim. gl )

do not be fooled by the first coment,, those guyz are idiots... they later also see that he was correct.

Those tutorials are wrong and were written by clueless people. If you only strafe left and right, your movement becomes predictable. LG aim is done with the mouse. High or low sens just depends on style/preference/whatever.

Yeah I agree, LG can be used in so many different ways / styles / situations, to counter the other players style, movement, weapons or plan. Thing is you have to master not just 1 style but them all. I love LG battles. My tip is always remember your players weaker style, stack and why your doing it...

Don't listen to any guides that say to only strafe aim. You want to be at a point where you're able to dodge and mouse aim perfectly regardless of your movement.

I find that lower sensitivity can steady your aim (and help with rail aim), but it has the drawback of requiring you to be able to move your arm fast against a dodging opponent. As long as you can maintain accuracy at higher sensitivities, I think higher sens is better for lg fights as it lowers your overall reaction time. I've recently lowered my sensitivity for cs and my lg in quake has stayed the same or is better for %, but I lose more lg fights.

>You want to be at a point where you're able to dodge and mouse aim perfectly regardless of your movement.

pretty much this.

Also you might want to use low base sens + medium accel. WIll take some time to get used to, but will have alot of benifits in long run.

Or masturbate for a beefy mousing arm.

i've also lowered by more than half my cs sens and now whenever i try to play ql it feels like a spastic ballet. mouse flying everywhere :S

Here we go with 2 videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRkYQANzNYs&a...up9acF1HYQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7eDTMpMUCY&a...up9acF1HYQ

One of the best (or maybe the best) lg+dodge in the world.

Zoom mouse2 ftw? EDIT: And I don't agree with, "or maybe the best". There's only one LG'er who's the best, and there's only 1 best dodger.

I mean he is one of the best (or maybe the best) if we consider both lg aim and lg dodge togheter.
He has zoom on alt and moveup on mouse2.

Zoom on alt seems handy. I agree with the first part, as he has defo got skillz in his genes. But still No "(maybe the best)" at both together.

I have zoom on 0x00 and mouse3
crouch on mouse2
and jump on spacebar.
and inverted m_yaw

and i love it.
XD

if some random is able to hit 45% lg on him, he is not anywhere near the best dodger. hitting 45% lg when a. you only have to move your mouse horizontally and b. ONLY worry about aim is also not impressive. one of the things that makes someone a good aimer is the ability to aim both horizontally and vertically, while simultaneously plotting your strategy and executing tactics in a timely fashion. see evil.

Comparing Hal and Evil? Really?

do you not see the post i'm responding to? he said the guy is has the best lg and dodge in the world.

You don't say. Obviously it's silly what he says, but your comparison, or specially the way you compare things is silly as well. You brought criteria you meet more in duel, no need to go that far...

can confirm. am random, hit 51% on hal.

I remember that :D

online LG lol

yeah, no

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2_yr3HTaVw

i was supershitty back then and did this against hal while he was in texas for quakecon and i was home in tennessee.

nerves+highsens+mouse with no feet on a piece of notebook paper = 51% LG against the supposed worlds best dodger!

food for thought

Last time that I explain what I mean: I think that he is one of the best lg fighter in the world, or maybe (MAYBE not for sure) the best. I don't say that he has the best dodge and neither the best aim, but in lg skill we must consider both this things togheter (on eyetoeye, the only map where almost every match is 1vs1 with a lot of lg figths, he has 668 win and 17 lost in his quakelive history).
And i repeat that i'm considering only lg fight skill, no lg skill when you must remember that red spawn in 3 seconds and that if you die you can take control because you probably spawn near mega, etc.

Nice lg track in the video you linked, but you say that you lost 10-6, 10-3, 10-3 so no problem for my sentence :)

You can see other video of him against top Europe lolca players (europe ca nations cup) on his youtube profile but no cam mouse.
However in my first post i say what i say only for introduce HAL to OP if he doesn't know him. If my sentence is a big problem, replace with this "i know these video of a quite decent lg player that show how he moves his mouse in lg fights. Youtube is so poor of long video about mouse movements in lg battles, so see this shit"

hal's dodges are not that good. His aim on the other hand is very impressive.

btw eyetoeye isn't only about lg duels, i can assure you, there s a lot of plasma spam/spawn rape with plasma/nades that you can abuse.

i personally prefer eyetoeye in CA, not duel ;)

surprise.

i have nothing against hal. i think he's alright. i just think that, were my situation different at the time, i wouldnt have lost those games, or lost by the margin that i did.

watching his videos isnt really that great of a way to teach people about LG. even the videos that cam his mouse.

LG is about finding a rhythm between mouse and strafe, and just the right amount of both without too much of either. everyone does it differently, but there's a perfect amount of strafe aim and mouse aim combined for everyone. if you can match your sensitivity to the speed a player model moves, and your accel to match the "rounding" effect, all it boils down to is how you move your mouse in relation to the direction you are moving and at what speed.

all you're doing is keeping the enemy in the center of the screen. you're not tracking with a mouse. play with no crosshair in 1v1 eyetoeye for about an hour and then use a crosshair in some CA games. ez.

It's a bit late to answer but:
I never hang out around in ESR, but I didn't expect that so many people were talking about easy things.
I remember when I played publics, with a laptop in my hotel room... During those (only pubcas I could've played, cause from the PCs I couldn't) I probably faced you...
It's funny to see those kind of things actually turn out to be totally important and relevant for others, I saw another guy posting a youtube fight of me against him in thunderstruck when I was in America..
I hope you somehow understood the big difference, but I enjoyed every single game, although I was going easy ;) ^^

Just come out with it already; you played with your feet while sleeping. : D

Don't talk shit, Hal. You barely shot 40 lg at Quakecon, and you got murdered by cl0ck. CLOCK.

Don't let him bother you. d3phx thinks he's hot shit. At the end of the day he's just an ordinary T4 player with very fragile ego.

my ego is fine, thanks for your concern. im glad you recognize that i think highly of myself as a quake player though. i tend not to get down on myself like most other poorly rounded quake players that zoomrail 90% of the games they play.

oh...sorry retribution...i didnt mean it like that


fucking fag

Complaining about CA matches. That tells me more about your mentality than your actions ever could. "think highly of myself as a CA player". There. Fixed that for you. Have fun blaming play styles and teammates for your loses. That's about all you'll be doing till the end.

:P

i remember you complaining about your fps and everyone was warping. i gotta poke a little fun though. it's not every day you get to see some nobody hit 50% LG overall on the "worlds best LG aimer/dodger"

Ooooh I'm in the video :P

:>

you cheating fuck!

:(

Wasn't back then :/

Has anyone mention tox yet?

If we have to nominate someone for best aim and dodge, it's gotta be him, especially with LG.
Just look at that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2HwxIaD3qc#t=15m45s

cyka nu blyad

yes, i totally agree

You can't JUST strafe aim as you cannot always perfectly match what your opponent is doing, and whenever you are not in sync, you have to get your crosshair back on them as soon as possible, so, you have to move your mouse.

You also usually need to be dodging anyway, so you're not actually going to be in sync with them, especially if they have an LG out too.

High sens (little mouse movement gives a lot of cursor movement) will get you near the opponent quickly, but you'll overshoot a lot trying to track rapid dodge.

Accel helps (for some, not all!) simply because it means your initial movement after reacting to their change in position is faster, and then you relax and slowly track them or even strafe aim while they're in a break between dodges.

Yeah, hard to get a balance sometimes, depending on situations.

[quote]High sens (little mouse movement gives a lot of cursor movement) will get you near the opponent quickly, but you'll overshoot a lot trying to track rapid dodge.[quote]

ekhm, bullshit.

Except that's exactly why most people with high sens get shitty LG, you don't get undershooting problems, in fact in general undershooting on reactions is simply not very human but it's definitely worse if using something overly sensitive.

i did not understand a word from the pile of bullshit you just threw up

most people with high sens get shitty LG because they are shit aimers, not because of the sensitivity, lel.

And you're not capable of thinking WHY they might have shitty aim?

insufficent hand eye coordination + bad position.

as i said: sensitivity is not relevant in any way to your lg aim.

The first part of this is pretty poor, as that's just a cop out, as there are plenty of lower twitched players with better technique. 2ndly, position is not in Yakumo's equation, as that is a different element altogether. And the 3rd part, what rubbish.

theres also plenty of low sens players who hit shit, even if its supposed to help your lg.

2 perfect examples of me being totally right is cypher and killsen. both hit incredible lg with sensitivity thats far from lowsens. if you're a good tracker you will hit decent even without monitor.

and secondly - position is everything in ql, therefore not taking it into consideration is plain dumb. the faster you nobos learn it the better.

cypher plays on 29.3981481481482 cm/360 (using sens/yaw from his cfg, based on 400dpi mouse as he favours wmo)

k1llsen is on ~30cm according to http://www.esreality.com/post/2636692/quake-l...-360-data/


They're both low sens.

under 15 cm/360 is what I start to consider high sens.

Even if you were right about that, finding a couple of players (especially pros lol) that can do insane things on ridiculous sens doesn't make anything I said incorrect.

And yes, plenty of people play on low sens thinking it will make their aim better but they just set it TOO low so they can't keep up because they're just not physically fast enough.

how convinient for you to have such "high sens" standards. even rapha is not highsens player for you.

also if 30cm is lowsens for you, then what about av3k, noctis or strenx?(i assume the values in thread you posted are correct)

how else can i prove you're dumb and wrong, if not by giving examples? thats how people argue: by proving own point with examples.

15cm or lower high sens and can be played wrist only.
higher than 15cm most people simply can't use wrist only aim without getting very bad wrist strain pretty soon.

Rapha on 20cm is mid, he's one of the lowest of the pros, that doesn't make him a 'low sens' user in the eyes of the masses.

what about noctis? he's a low sens player ~35cm with accel off, and uses accel.
strenx is low sens ~50cm
so's mew when he was on 80cm

just because a few good players use ridiculously low sensitivities doesn't mean there's a need for me to redefine what I considered high,mid, low.

And you're actually the first person in all this time I've ever met to argue it.
Feel free to keep your subjective scale, but the only people you meet that will consider 30cm low sens are those very used to playing on even lower (40cm etc).

This is pretty pointless anyway, if you consider rapha high sens on 20cm, then obviously 15cm is still high sens.

Why do people do it in cm's? when it's dpi?
If the mouse is calculating it in inches then why make it cms? or is the "i" not a real inch?

Because some of us prefer metric.

Look, read the question he was asking at the start of this topic. Your own positioning is different from pure aim. Obviously your own positioning is very important along with many other factors. As I said before, it wasn't to do with what Yakumo was saying about aim and sensitivity. It was to do with reacting to the others position.

it was the answer to Yakumo's question, not op's question.

Yes and he was pointing out about sensitivity, and reacting to the other persons position. Gah! read.

yakumo asked me what makes ppl aim bad if its not sensitivity related. therefore i gave him an anwser, which obviously goes beyond simple mouse movement.

gah! read?

Quite wriggling and trolling check Yakumo's post you replied to "comment 9" end of.

hitsu doesn't believe in the ability to improve your aim. You are either a good aimer due to talent or you'll never be.

Hitsu must be shitty aimed I assume :)

If you can't 360 when you jump across that gap on tunderstruck then your sens is too low. You need a sens high enough to swing behind someone with lg to dodge them and shit.

So what your saying is just backrape to get good at lg?

I was kind of trolling but no, I'm warning against using a super low sensitivity thinking it will help your LG when you can't even turn fast enough to track a close target that's dodging, let alone be any good with any other weapons. If anything, if you just want to whore LG and don't give a shit about playing Quake, using accel is a good suggestion.

Okay, but why 360 and not 180? And yeah that's another part of LG, ranges and also who starts first.

because 360s are so cute :D

Sens does matter, but you need to find what's best for "you" overall. With videos, go quakecon YouTube page (Link below) and watch some duels from this years Qcon. You can get good ideas of "how to" and "why to" use LG. Then think about the battles they won or lost with it, or against LG, and why they won or lost. Then practice..........

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaquFi5JOPWPFNwy11oPx2w

If that doesn't work...Well I sure Strenx could help you, if you got the wonga.

lg sucks

my lg is sucks :(

You want to move your mouse and strafe... Doing one or the other only is wrong.

Sensitivity is a complete preference. High sensitivities require more dexterity for your fingers, while low sensitives require you to be able to move your arm fast.

Does the Sensitivity actually affect the LG? Since people say its all about strafing and to not move the mouse.

Yes it does ;). Ofc there are some exceptions, like latrommi or k1llsen, both high sens players, and they hit very hard still :).

but tbh i would recommend a sens between 20cm and 35cm without accel. Ofc like i said you can get used to basically anything but still, any sens that is <20cm and >35cm are unreasonable, are a bit too "extreme".
Being a mid-sens player is the best :)

and nop, it's not only about strafing. It depends on your playstyle. Some people use strafe-aim a lot while others just mouse aim. Usually the best dodgers in the world use more mouse aim than strafe aim (cooller for example).

You have to find out your playstyle. Like, if you're more an aim based player or a dodges based player. Or maybe 50/50.

But how does it come that people then say that low sens would be best for lg, if those tutorials always tell me to learn to aim with "A+D" (and moving the mouse while aiming too much was bad)

Like I said, mid-sens is best. This way you don't have the disadvantages of too low sens or too high sens. I personally like when it's balanced :).

Nice advice, today i tried to shoot with space or any other key to not have to use Mouse1, but im so used to Mouse1...i dont think i want to waste months to get used to a keyboard key for shooting just to (MAYBE) have a little better aim at the end, lol.

What sens are you at ? Is there any dpi which is best for lg, if there might be any reason for it...

dont change bindings based on someone that told you "mouse2 for jumping or gtfo" or "keyboard key for shooting improves your aim". whatever minimal difference there might be - it gets stomped by the the fact that you will never fully adapt to it. stick to your settings unless they are really weird and stick to your periphal hardware (or buy new ones that resemble your old stuff in shape).

i know the idea of performing better because of changes in setup sound tempting. but the sad fact is that the only thing that will improve anything is: trailing, training, training. whenever i changed something in the past (did that way to often) i felt a little improvement first, but that was because of motivation and increased focus. after a couple of hours i always returned to something that resembled my former setup.

like He4rTL3sS said; 20-35cm for a 360° is pretty comon. if you are within that range and either use no or low accel the best thing you can do is to not touch your settings - EVER. if you are not you can do small changes, but even then chances are you will just end up beeing worse than before.

yeah, i get that keyboard thing, but i changed jumping to mouse2 (alrdy 1+ year ago) and i totally loved it like after a hour of practicing with it....but i think the shooting key on keyboard isnt worth it.

Only fegs that like defrag use m2 for jump.

I use m2 for jump.. =(

What Heartless and Lave said, & if you struggle with the people who try to get you at the maximum distance, to suit their low sens & movements, bind zoom. Then you get the ultimate balance.

With regards to dpi, some say it is best to keep things unscaled, so whatever default mouse dpi is out of the box, use that.

What sens are you at ? Is there any dpi which is best for lg, if there might be any reason for it...

I'm playing with 23.5cm/360° for quite a long time now, no accel. I used to play with 30-32cm/360° for 2-3 years but more recently decided to change for different reasons, that's why I play with 23.5cm now.

I also know that stermy and hal are both using something like 22-24cm/360° and no accel. I also know quite a lot of very good aim-heavy players that play with 20cm+/360°.

With my "new" sens, I can play on a medium sized mousepad, which takes less space on the desk and also is cheaper than a large sized mousepad :P.

And concerning the dpi : it doesn't matter. Most people are using low dpi (from 400 to 500dpi) with med/low sens. The rest are using medium dpi (from 800 to 1600). But only a few players are using high/very high dpi (from 2000 to 6400).
I'm personally using medium dpi (1800).

I would probably personally recommend low dpi if you're a very low sens player, medium dpi if you're a medium sens player and high dpi if you're high sens player.

Ofc there are some exceptions, like latrommi or k1llsen, both high sens players, and they hit very hard still :).

if anything, k1llsen uses low sens: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJlOwGdkg0k

yep hes pretty much on 40cm + med accel. i guess because of his flickery movement people always assume he has some rediculous high sens

map angles are huge. dodge according to the map aswell. ie; newbs tend to dodge away from you because of fear, they run for the doorway to get to a safe position. this makes them very easy to read. you could instead act like you go for a doorway and juke back giving the opportunity to dish out just that bit more LG to get the kill.

try and make sure you get the first blip out with LG when possible. by surprising your enemy, or in situations where you start with an accurate rocket and switch to LG straight away while hes still halfway in the air or w/e.

strafe aiming isnt as bad as people claim. the trick is to hit incredibly hard, while also taking increased damage.

just try not be to overly predictable when it comes to movement. incorporating short dodges can also work very well rather than 5 feet to the left 4 feet to the right etc. switch it up and get your mouse aim used to your own movement.

you wont suddenly understand how people move in quake by playing a couple of weeks, especially in CA which is all i play (more open area straight up LG fights). i kind of know how every player in the game moves. either because ive seen them before or learning and countering after the first 1-3 rounds, then just dial in and go to town. duel/ctf/tdm make muuuuch more use of map angles and positioning properly.

other than this, its practice x3.

oh and to ur original question about mouse sens and LG, i think its well established by now that a lower than average mouse sens is optimal for LG. but this can hinder your movement (can add accel, wouldnt advise it for rookies) and it can also make rocket aiming harder. find the right path for yourself what feels comfortable.

me, i play fingertip/claw style with zowie ec1 evo. no accel anymore. around 19.5cm/360. reduced yaw and increased pitch for easy rocketjumping. and i zoom for long range LG. problem i have is i need to be warmed up to hit good lg with this setup, but it can work really well.

IMO accell never had anything to do with being rookie or grand master. I mean come on it's not CS forum ]:-)
Some nice 0.01 is good starting point for accell : 3 :

these days? yeah i think its fairly unique to have a game where you can set up accel in great detail. and for people who are new to quake and/or new to arena fps gaming, i think accel might confuse them more rather than help. im not saying you shouldnt give it a try, just that its better to try without accel first. try low/mid/high sens and see if that feels comfortable. accel starts to play a role if low sens is the only thing that works and you cant turn around properly imo.

edit; favourite gametype matters too. ca > ctf > tdm > duel when it comes to chaos vs control. low sens can feel rather constricting in clan arena. thats my experience at least :)

I forgot that games don't have cvars and shitload of settings :D

Baring in mind, this guy made a ridiculously long cheater list after he received a massive arse kicking and quit quake. Lol.

Lol!

Not wrong though, am i?

keep tryharding m8

well you obviously failed massively at it, so you were tryharding in the first place?
i guess that's the only thing what could generate such a huge list lol

Dude, I dont care :P

Do what you want! Buy as many QL copies on Steam and go wild!

One copy is all i need bro :)

http://www.twitch.tv/hafticho/b/685233847
starts at 25:30
that guy was a random so no big
aim but still 59 with some potat nades
at the end

Just point and shoot man

old thread, but i think its worth mentioning that if you do a lot of defrag or strafe maps and really figure out how to get the most out of your movement, best mouse aim to gain speed faster etc, your LG control will be much better.

when i started learning how the mouse movements actually affect how much speed you gain and how quickly you gain it, i really started having better mouse control and that translates to LG aim.

d3phx, bro, why did u hide your video after hal put u in ur place?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2_yr3HTaVw

i didnt hide it, i wiped out my youtube channel completely and started from scratch. i got tired of seeing all my old vids.