This is better:
http://www.funender.com/quake/mouse/index.html

strenx and linkin cms are not correct.

Also analysing sensitivity of players using accel = useless unless they use a ridiculously low amount of accel (remember accel depend on mouse dpi)

it depends on sensitivity value in QL not on DPI to be correct

So why do i need like 0.001 accel with 1800dpi and 0.1 with 400 to get the same feel ? The difference is huge...

Because he's thinking about what injx called the Q value or about the m_cpi stuff.

Ah ,yeah with m_cpi the accel stays the same

actually, you only need 0.0045 at 400 if you would use 0.001 on 1800. Just do it x4.5 (1800/400=4.5)

(old dpi/ new dpi)^2 * accel.

Oh really, I did not know that. I guess the 2 depends on cl_mouseaccelpower though?

That would actually make 0.02025 on 400dpi. That is quite a big difference.

Pretty sure it has to do with how accel is done in quake and not a specific parameter.
Remove the ² and you have the formula for the sensitivity.

Good to know. I wasnt trying to be exact tho ,just prove my point

because when you change DPI you change sensitivity as well hence accel is different

B + (A(v-C))^(P-1)

B - Sensitivity (Default "4")
A - cl_MouseAccel (Default "0")
C - cl_MouseAccelOffset (Default "0")
P - cl_MouseAccelPower (Default "2")
v - Velocity (if m_cpi is set to its default of 0, this value is in counts per millisecond. If it is >0 and hopefully set to correctly the cpi of your mouse, the value is in cm/second)
(c) Lorfa

So technically it is DPI/CPI independent

and ofcourse if you do not change sense but change only DPI it will feel faster just because quake interperets more counts as faster mouse movement, while sens added per cm/s stays the same.

C + (O(o-L))^(L-E)R

C - ?
O - ?
O - ?
L - ?
L - ?
E - ?
R - ?

So technically cooller wins

and ofcourse cooller

Saint cooller wins even if he loses.

(c) injx

Interesting, but we need a wider range of players to examine, like half of those are not even active anymore.

And of course, this doesn't take into account accel OR weird functioning mice, like the Kinzu v1 strenx uses or k1llsen's mouse (I think it'a a G9x but i might be wrong).

If you look at that spread, and all those decimals, just do what makes you feel good :)

So mathematical this whole thing. With fov and fov changes, accel, yaw, pitch, and weapon sens changes, zoom sens, all of these make it difficult to plot like that as a real likeness. Also resolution; aspect ratio / ie. 4:3 16:9 16:10 5:4, can give different horizontal fovs and vertical heights, not to mention scaling on mouse or monitor, and dpi or in_mouse options etc... That's a lot of graph plotting 4 you!

Stick to what feels good for you :)

Why would you look at what duelers use? You don't need good aim to be successful in duel. Looking at what good players ca players use is a much more reliable way to get a good idea of what works.

Also that list is broken, most of those players use a shit ton of accel.

I believe when those CA players who're good nowadays in CA started out, they also tried the stuff the pros were using. And probably still are jumping around that. Even though it doesnt really matter anymore, since its kinda known that anything from 20-40cm is 100% playable and any lower or higher sensitivity is personal liking.

Not really, if you came from another game you will use whatever sens suits you best. I find 6.9cm/360 is the best for me.

It's not a sensitivity that everyone can use, and I won't be able to play well with it if I was older(e.g past age 25)

Could you elaborate further on the age argument? :)

You absolutely 100 fucking percent do need "good aim" in duel saying otherwise just shows you know nothing about duel.

Looking at the guys who've been playing for money and trying to get every competitive edge possible for over the last 15 years makes a hell of a lot more sense than looking at random ca pub heroes.

How so? A lot of the aiming in duel is simply spam. It's why players like k1llsen, p0ni, etc can't aim outside duel. Take a look at k1llsen's ca footage, it's bad.
it's also why tox loses to any decent lg dueler in 1v1 ca.

A lot of the people on this forum seem to make fun of people like heartless, but from an outsiders perspective it's clear his lightning gun aim is a lot better than pretty much all the duelers.

And it's also pretty clear he isn't able to do anything with it during duels.

Look, I'm a total and utter noob at duel, but I can still assure you that you just can't make it without aim in duel. There is no use being in good position or having internal timing machine in your brain or whatever if you cannot hit your shots. Also, spam is many times an element that is not done for the damage output, but rather to block entrances, to provide cover for yourself, deny position, or to delay your opponent or whatever the multitude of reasons there are for spamming.

i would like to see this toxic 1v1 ca demo/footage.

i will ask idoser and depas if they still got the demo where they beat toxjq at 1v1 CA lg only ;)

maybe they still got it ^^

and also yrx beating toxjq at CA with all weapons ;)

rope,idoser,depas,yrx etc. beat tox pretty handily at 1v1 CA

i want to see it, not read it.

what lan was that?

I would not say this 1vs1 Thunderstruck bullshit is the reference of aiming in quake. In duel you have to aim depending on youre position or other parameters and btw there is not only the LG in quake which requires aiming ;)

Look at agent before he improved his LG. He often losed his control only because of his bad LG aim.

Thunderstruck is also alot about dodge. I suck at dodge and suck at thunderstruck but i can outaim guys in duel who outaim me on thunderstruck.

If you wanted to say duel is not only about raw aim youre right, but saying duel is not about aiming is bullshit.

lol@1v1ca

"k1llsen can't aim outside duel"

..stopped reading there.

i have demos where k1llsen loses 1on1 lg fights in CA where he is literally 1on1 with 200 100 and there is no one else

killsen lg has never been at the same level of tox/evil/strenx

i have seen k1llsen win ca rounds dealing 900+ dmg in 4v4 versus all 2000+ elo opponents

No-one said he's the best. Just saying k1llsen can't aim is a tad bit retarded). Prolly jiggly fake or some other us fag.

Maybe for my standards https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JO_XVacSQuY&t=2m15s

The read from that ffx guy. Beast. K1llsen didn't even see him coming. Like a phantom.

lol

well a 1 minute stretch off a random game who knows when. Looks like a very solid scientific process to demonstrate your point.

The whole game, not just that part.

All you have to do is skip to the end of that video and check the scoreboard to see k1llsen dominated the server. :|

Obviously he has not seen him on Overkill with a rail then?

A lot of the people on this forum seem to make fun of people like heartless, but from an outsiders perspective it's clear his lightning gun aim is a lot better than pretty much all the duelers.

thanks man! :)

Actually I know quite a lot of CA players who are better than duelers at.... CA. They play CA 24/24 7/7, so it's pretty normal that they are better than most duelers at it.
Duel is more about knowing how to play defensively and how to win a fight with superior stack and weapon(s). At duel, the situations where you have the same stack and weapon(s) than your opponent and also equal positioning are in fact pretty rare, while at 1v1 CA it happens ALL THE TIME :D. So it seems pretty obvious to me that those practicing 1v1/2v2/4v4 CA for years are better at it than most duelers.

And yes, i think that if you want to measure raw combat skills (aim & dodges) it's better to look at the CA players, because in CA it's pretty much "aim and shoot", while in duel there are quite a lot of strategies and experience, that are more important than raw combat skills, altho combat skills are still important, but less than at CA ofc.

Only few (former) top duelers are good/very good at CA. People like stermy(but his little brother hal is still better than him at CA), strenx, k1llsen(for k1llsen, i still have my doubts regarding his skill at clanwar against good CA players, but at pub CA he's really good), spart1e(when he's not drunk :P) and so on... But av3k for example isn't that good at it, and cypher never plays CA, so how can he be good at it ? :D
And even with that, most of them don't/didn't play duel only. They play CA as well so they're not duel only players.

So k1llsen and poni has no aim outside duel? :)

People make fun of heartless because he's constantly preaching about thunderstruck 1v1 ca lg-battles on a site where pretty much everyone thinks it is a shitty mode if you're out to compare skills. Quake is a lot more than accuracies. Proof? Look at what Rapha has achieved with mediocre (compared to the top players) aim and outstanding control/positioning.

What are you supposed to do with 70% shaft accuracy if you never get the chance to even pick up the weapon? Players who rely on control avoid open fights so why wouldn't they adjust their tactic to deny a certain weapon?

I'm not talking about that stuff though. You wouldn't exactly go to rapha for aim advice unless you wanted to learn how to shoot the ground real good with rockets.

Wrong. If you ever used Raphas mouse settings you'd know why his hitscan aim is worse but still - he aims incredibly well. I would gladly ask for hints on how to aim with his combination of sensitivity/accel.

Look. You don't seem to have much clue at all based on reading a couple of posts in this thread.
I suggest you stop posting nonsense saving everyone the effort to correct you.

I don't really need anyone's advice from esreality regarding aim honestly. If I can do 60% rail and at least 45% lg per game at 6.9cm/360 I think I'm okay.

Find it hard to believe you're not either really picking the situations you use it, or you're just playing tier3 or lower players.

Your accuracy would drop if you played with tier 3 players. They tend to have 5billion ping and an insane amount of jitter.

this is a gold mine

Seriously needs an update. That is from 4 years ago.

when did stermy use 22.35 cm/360? :/

Pretty much always. Sens 4.5 with a 3.0 is around 22cm.

i tought he was very very very low sens whore :o

Nah, he just happens to have crazy good control over his right hand :D

you made that sound dirty

You heard that dirty but nobody can blame you, it's stermy.

stermy's settings are funny, he used direct input for the longest time, he uses an MLT04 mouse which gets iinconsistant cpi values based on what seems to be generation of model from 400-450 (I got 420 on my WMO and so did faerie on his IE3), his sens was 4.63 and went,down to 4.5 then 4.2 and I recall him complaining that mouse sensitivity is higher on windows 7 but I might be wrong about that.

so taking into account that clusterfuck his sens is around 20-24cm/360 and whether he meant to keep the same sens or lower it slightly is beyond my knowledge, but I'd assume the former because the changes look more like adaptation to new setups than anything.

My ime 3.0 is 420 cpi as well. There must have been a stoner working at Microsoft that day.

As this point I'm pretty sure they've always been 420/430ish dpi but that nobody gave a fuck until Gillz went full Gillz 5 or 6 years ago.

I think it's because of how the shells changed overtime (cutting costs?, new molds?)
Bringing the lens closer to the mouse pad(I heard that it can increase cpi, not sure though), that or something is up with the PCBs.
Though it's not that uncommon for CPI values to be reported differently or incorrectly heck I got differences of 100cpi by changing mousepads and retesting.

sensor position doesn't change the cm/360°.
it mostly imfluences aiming with your wrist.
http://www.esreality.com/post/2410040/new-gam...-and-more/

That's not what rauvz said.

that's true.

I was talking about height of sensor from the mousepad and different shells making is lower/higher

haha ye, not fully arrived yet.

umm, who's cooler on the graph? I only know a Cooller.

^this. the graph has zero harosh with such blasphemy

Early 2009 called and they want bodzo back ;D

rapha and strenx use a ton of accel

also old as fuck

If you're talking about strenx's old cfg, he didn't actually use accel ( the senscap was set too low for any accel to kick in ).

kinzu v1 has accel too

Far from being a ton.

I have a kinzu v1. Back in 2012 I asked Strenx if his kinzu had lots of accel, he said there was none. Later on I did that trick uninstalling the drivers and I got rid of basically all accel. I heard some people saying that it has built-in acceleration on the sensor, and you can't get rid of that, but if its true, it's a very tiny bit of it, at least in my case.

Strenx seems to doesn't give a fuck about mouse or settings.
He is just a talented guy.

But honestly kinzu v1 got tons of accel, but it doesnt mean u can't play with it.

With the latest driver, yes, there is TONS of accel. Without it, I doubt there is any noticeable amount of it.

dude...
there is even a "ton" of accel in the kinzu v1 without drivers.
if you wanna test it, do a 360° ingame, while you move the mouse very slowly, then try it again at moderate speed over the same distance, and you will already do two 360° or something.

lmao

I did tests like this a thousand times already. But just for the sake of my own sanity, I did it AGAIN, and NOP, no "tons" of accel, if there is ANY accel in my mice.

Also, I was an accel user for years, I know how it works and how it feels.

it still has the most accel of any mouse.
you do some swipes, and you are far away from where you actually should be.

You have confused me

well that's not very hard now is it?

If you can do a 180 with your wrist with or without accel your fine. Lower is just to much work if your not duel only imo.

i reach about 45° to each side, with using my wrist only and that is with ~30cm/360° which isn't even so low sens.

Are you paralyzed? :<

dunno, at least i get no "RSI" when i don't use full ROM of my wrist while playing.
or maybe i already have RSI, and that is why my ROM is limited. :D

just no...