tl;dw?

netcode is shit.

You could've rick rolled us to the same effect

start watching @ https://youtu.be/WITA9DpejSg?t=1188

QC servers have serious performance issues

There's a weird bug where players will always appear to fire at least 2 shots from MG / nailgun despite the shooter firing only once

Custom servers are completely unlagged for hitscan, so a euro playing against an american could hit him far behind cover with hitscan weapons.

good vid, I suspect this is not going to solved anytime soon ...
there also probably won't be any optimization of the engine to run faster, so it works better on older systems

Great video, so does anyone know how this translates to getting around this in QC?

Using a shaft for example, some people seem to hit far more shots than others, should you be aiming the cross hair slightly in front of where you predict the opponent will go or something?

Higher server tickrate and better server performance, smaller lag reconciliation window forcing people to lead their shots more (helps with around corner shots).

The biggest issue right now though has more to do with client extrapolation as clients are getting pushed to far ahead creating situations where you have to aim behind people, you need to compensate for that on the client and push positions back, something QC seemingly doesn't do at the moment.


This is an issue i have complained about in QL as well. Though QL is not even close to the amount of extrapolation issues that qc produce currently.

Server tick rate of 60 is fine. It's more than we've ever had in QL, which uses 40.

We just need the server itself not to be a potato and run efficiently.

I'd say the biggest issue is that the lag introduced at the server end makes the game feel very high ping. This combined with the what may as well be uncapped backward reconciliation has you gauntleted from the other side of the room, and similar, on a regular basis.

Other than that, the game is a warper's paradise just like QL but worse. Nothing substantial is done to smooth this out. I think there is extrapolation (you can see bodies teleport when you kill them), but if it is gonna be as bad as this, they may as well turn it off; it's not worth saving only 17ms, which everyone will have anyway. Much better to have shit smooth.

For my taste, I just wish we were all on the LAN.

One day we will all go to the great LAN in the sky, where we shall sit at the right hand of the Cooller. :D

No, we shall sit on his left hand side, so that our lord and savior has more space for his mouse.

Should have been more clear on what i mean about tickrate.
Currently they are sending packets at 16ms intervals, which is roughly 60hz.

What i believe they are doing is sending entity updates at 20hz.
Things also point to physics and game logic being run at 60hz or more (physics most likely being based on player updates/framerate).

Extrapolation is being performed on every entity currently, the armor shards bouncing around and glitching into place, players warping after death is proof of that.

Further more extrapolation and varying tickrates would explain why rockets pop out of nowhere when you fired them before they opted to using their currently broken predicted rockets/nails, this simply because the physics would get X amounts of ms ahead before sending the last known position with the result being the rocket shows up a bit through it's trajectory.

Essentially if i am right physics updates 4 times for every network update and never really syncs up, this gets worsened when the server performance dips creating even larger variance between them both... These two issues also create delayed knockback and feedback.

The same thing happens in terms of players, which will effectively fuck any accuracy in terms of extrapolation, which in turn will also fuck up accuracy in client side prediction as it will not receive position corrections fast enough. The last part being very clear when playing on servers with 200 ping, to where rubber banding will be extreme, something i have only experienced when server and client physics do not matchup because of differing physics functions or physics getting borked because of varying frametimes.
The last part being avoidable by locking server and client physics,upload to the same fixed tickrate......
You can also see it when you are running behind people and getting shot with their back turned to you.


And last, the delayed updates cause a lot of issues for the movement prediction on clients. This in turn creates even more issues with their predicted rockets and nails with them failing and people having invisible rockets explode into corners they weren't even aiming at anymore.

Proof or rockets being predicted? There is literally no delay even on 400ms. To the point where you can fire them when rubberbanding all over the place, mid correction even.

Oh I totally agree that rockets are almost certainly predicted. And I have guessed that players are too due to the death teleport.

I have no idea, though, why the server would update clients 60 times per second, sending what is actually a truckload of data, when only 1 in 3 of those updates has new info.

None of these problems require the server to be running at 20Hz, and in fact, we didn't have a lot of these issues to such extremes in previous Quakes that were actually running at 20Hz.

The server may just be choking a lot of the time and failing to process it in the available window. There is probably a lot of inefficiency there, just as we see in the 200-250 byte per frame upload the game uses.

And their extrapolation is clearly not doing anything to help with warpers.

Weird Productions ™

The biggest issue I have is the game stuttering like crazy whenever I hit an opponent. 1 hit = 1 stutter it seems, most obvious on LG, but not excluded from MG. You don't notice it so much on RG because single fire.

Hopefully they can fix that for online play.

i feel like ur overlooking a lot of stuff if thats ur biggets issue with qc

Agreed. Quake Stutter Edition :(

Starts happening to me after 2-3 maps played and i need to restart the game after that

it would be nice, if he (or someone else) could explain how, while qc is using unlagged for hitscan weapons, some shots don't register, even with pings much lower than 80. it's supposed to be where u aim is where u hit until a certain high ping. I have about 62 and watched recorded vids after the games and that doesn't hold true.

The server tries to figure out what the game looked like on your screen when you fired by rewinding the server state by the total lag and doing the same calculations your client would have done to position players. There is room for error in calculating the total lag accurately and in doing those calculations.

Of course, as the video says, if the server isn't fast enough, you get problems too.

maybe then their problem is that they don't calculate lag correctly. Sometimes it seems like we have impossibly good pings in far away datacenters (or the opposite, but the lagging might be true, but having 0-20 ping in any server outside my country, for sure it isn't).

I mean that if their data server in Germany thinks that I have 15 ping, while I have 70, then that difference will through the calculations off.

if that is true, the problem could be as simple, as fixing the way they estimate lag

in any case, they seem to have huge problems with their datacenters

Well, it is a tricky thing, and I don't know whether it ties into the ping they show on the scoreboard. There's other sources of delay to account for than just ping, and that is fluctuating. Lucky for us it's not our job to fix it. :D

One thing I did forget to mention is that your client can be predicting things, and if those predictions turn out wrong, that can mess up hit reg too.

I think rockets, for example, are predicted now, to make them look instant. Players might be a bit too.

Netcode:

Direct rocket no dmg
https://clips.twitch.tv/MoldySillyHedgehogFUNgineer

Rails behind walls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jt7Y4RO9lg