I really like that you see the trajectory of the player

Nice stuff with the ogrimar hub thng, but ofc you can frag them? Or enter a duel request like in wow?

It's likely be an option when you create a hub. I imagine the public ones be a no frag zone.

ye, i would thought so as well.

I still don't understand who is the target audience of this game.

A fast-paced multiplayer Arena FPS set in a colourful robot universe developed by former Quake and esport professionals.

Gee, I wonder.

Yea because he is clearly aiming at the 100 Reflex/Warsow/Xonotic players.

Why are you afraid this is cpm clone?

I think calling these three games cpm clones is not fair.

And my point was that vq3 players are in general not so excited about double-jumps, dash-jumps and air control.

As i know james said limited an not like cpm air control, i dont think this has changed much, but ye i like vq3 movmebt but i dont mind giving djumps a try.

It's fun but from the past 7 years I can tell you it is damn hard to attract new players to such games. QL players are mostly meh this is not vq3. New kids are meh, where is the sprint button, why is this guy moving so much faster than I.

Won't be easy for James to find a solution there.

I'd say new players look at QL/vq3 movement and think it looks too slow...

That's why a pure vq3 remake wouldn't work either (in terms of sales).

In my experience, friends that don't play Quake think that it looks blazing fast when I show them gameplay.

Same, doesn't even matter which version, or mod, etc...

.. while they themselves move like snails when trying the game.

What?

English, motherfucker. Do you speak it?

Dont worry the things james will do with comunity hubs, might be just more impressive then the game itself. If that doesnt tie in the community nothing will.

How did so many new people learn to play Dota then lol

What exactly do you mean by "who is the target audience"?

What is there to not understand? They are doing what they think is a great AFPS game and hope every FPS player out there will like.

They are incorporating e-sports support, mod tools, social hubs etc.

They are targeting every single gamer out there that wants to play an FPS game and for those that come up with other ideas there are mod tools for your disposal.

I mean who is QC targeting? Everyone and no one. They are hoping that all FPS gamers lovers will play their game whether they come from Call of Duty, Overwatch or Quake. Unlike what the Internet believes they don't include passive abilities because Overwatch has sold many copies.

"They are targeting every single gamer out there that wants to play an FPS game"

Tactical shooter fans will stop with playing Rainbow Six Siege and Counter-Strike to hop around with cute quake robots? Ok.

Fans of massive battles will say goodbye to Battlefield to hop around with cute quake robots? Ok.

MOBA FPS fans will uninstall Overwatch to hop around with cute quake robots? Ok.


"I mean who is QC targeting? Everyone and no one."
If they do that, they will fail. There is a reason why companies first run a market analysis before even making a rough draft of a new product.

So you are upset that it is "cute quake robots", and predict that the aesthetics of such will defer players from the game?

Well I don't think that it necessarily will be the case, although it might be for some. I think that the main selling point and attraction is the competitive oriented gameplay and the features surrounding the game.

Why don't you focus on that?

I am not upset nor scared or whatever, just stating my opinion.

I also think that this will be an eSport focused game. Still my questions remain, where are the players supposed to come from? How many people are interested in arena fps eSports? How can you increase that number without a big name (e.g. Quake) or a decent budget?

It's not like Reflex and UT4 are bursting from players.

If Diabotical is able to ensure as little as 5k viewers for regular tournaments, it will quickly snowball in attention and interest, if the gameplay is good enough to produce as entertaining matches as we know already know from Quake, which imo is one of the best spectator games yet. There is not really any reason why this quality should not transfer to Diabotical, so by this alone, the interest could increase.

People watching the game on Twitch does however not entail them actually playing it them selves. The game just has to look appealing and interesting to newcomers from other genres. Overwatch has drawn players in from many other games than FPS's, which shows us that it is more than possible. You could assert that is just because of the Blizzard franchise alone, that the game has enjoyed such a following, but I don't see that as being the case over gameplay appeal.

If the game is not fun to new players, it will quickly die after an initial enthusiasm. Why would quake-clone gameplay suddenly be fun for 2016 gamers?

You said it yourself, in best case it can produce matches as entertaining as good old quake. I don't see today's gamers going crazy about quake gameplay. It's a niche within fps gaming.

The ads Blizzard put on TV for Overwatch alone ate more money than the whole Diabotical budget combined. Whether one likes the game or not, it is something new and apparently meant to target the huge MOBA audience (yea I doubt they were like, uh let's make a fps for everyone).

You presume that the game will not be fun. You have to justify that assumption or I can disregard it as intellectually irrelevant to this discussion as an unfounded assertion.

I did not say that in best case it could produce as entertaining matches as Quake. Nor did I imply that Quake gameplay itself isn't attractive to "today's gamers", whomever that is supposed to be. I said, that I see no reason why Diabotical would not be as well suited as a spectator game as Quake is, and it could even be better.

Quake has been a niche because the game is old as fuck. Younger generations did not grow up with the game, and has not been exposed to the game, because it had mostly died out before Twitch came around and esports popularity exploded just a few years back. So it is not a matter of people having discarded Quake as being boring, when people haven't even had the chance to discard it to begin with.

CS had died out almost as much as Quake, and then suddenly a newer version, in form of CS:GO, which is surrounded with modern infrastructure was released. The game skyrocketed in popularity, and they didn't change anything about the core gameplay. I will point to that as an example to you as to why the same could be the case for Quake. All that is needed is a modernization of the presentation of the game, and the newer generations will be all over it. Why would they not when it was the case for us?

Regarding Overwatch; it has kept it's popularity which would not be the case if the game had nothing going for it besides a huge advertisement budget. It is not enough to just be "new", which the ton of various MOBA's that have gone away just as quickly as they emerged are a testimony to. It is the big titles like dota2 and LoL that remain, and all other seem to fade away, barely making them selves visible. MOBA has been a buzzword for developers the past years, kinda like MMO was once, and obviously Overwatch has to have something to offer in terms of gameplay to begin with in order to retain any sort of following.

You presume that the game will not be fun. You have to justify that assumption or I can disregard it as intellectually irrelevant to this discussion as an unfounded assertion.

I did not say that the game won't be fun. I said if they stick to the classic quake formula then there is no reason why new players would find it more interesting than other games, that follow the same formula.

Quake has been a niche because the game is old as fuck. Younger generations did not grow up with the game, and has not been exposed to the game, because it had mostly died out before Twitch came around and esports popularity exploded just a few years back. So it is not a matter of people having discarded Quake as being boring, when people haven't even had the chance to discard it to begin with.

How many players tried Quake Live after the steam release? How many stayed? Have you watched youtube videos of people trying Quake Live due to the steam release? It was a disaster.

CS had died out almost as much as Quake, and then suddenly a newer version, in form of CS:GO, which is surrounded with modern infrastructure was released. The game skyrocketed in popularity, and they didn't change anything about the core gameplay. I will point to that as an example to you as to why the same could be the case for Quake. All that is needed is a modernization of the presentation of the game, and the newer generations will be all over it. Why would they not when it was the case for us?

Lack of a big name, lack of millions of euros. Also games with "realistic" weapons are far more accessible in general. Every idiot knows what a pistol is, a sniper and an assault rifle. You can get a random person from the street and show him/her CS and he/she would understand at least 90% of the concept of the game immediately. And I guess war never gets boring.

Regarding Overwatch; it has kept it's popularity which would not be the case if the game had nothing going for it besides a huge advertisement budget. It is not enough to just be "new", which the ton of various MOBA's that have gone away just as quickly as they emerged are a testimony to. It is the big titles like dota2 and LoL that remain, and all other seem to fade away, barely making them selves visible. MOBA has been a buzzword for developers the past years, kinda like MMO was once, and obviously the game has to have something to offer in terms of gameplay to begin with in order to retain any sort of following.

Which does not mean that the advertisement wasn't required to get it going in the first place. And as you write yourself, it offers something in terms gameplay that appeals to the current generation of gamers.

Would you prefer if people kept trying to make appealing Quake-like games until, hopefully, one sticks and we finally have a game where there are enough players to be able to play something other than lolca or would you rather that no one ever tries to make a game like Quake again?

It's not like any of these developers are funding their development with your money, so why are you so adamant about convincing everyone that there will never be a game that's 1) like Quake and 2) has more than 100 players online at a given time?

People play "lolca" because it is fun to them. Is it possible to create other modes that are as accessible as "lolca" but more advanced? I think so, but it takes more than simply reproducing what is already there and adding a bunch of gimmicks.

why are you so adamant about convincing everyone that there will never be a game that's 1) like Quake and 2) has more than 100 players online at a given time?

I did not say that. But as you are so keen on calling everyone a retard, you can figure that out by yourself.

How do you explain Dota and League then

Why would quake-clone gameplay suddenly be fun for 2016 gamers?

Implying that it isn't fun and implying the same for Diabotical.

How many players tried Quake Live after the steam release? How many stayed?

When it became available on Steam it was essentially a re-release of a repackaged and re-released game from 1999. Why would you sight the Steam release as something that would provide the necessary means of revitalizing Quake to begin with? It just became more accessible.

Lack of a big name, lack of millions of euros.

Isn't Quake a big title which has a great legacy? It has just been so long since it was relevant that the newcomers has no knowledge about it. Like DOOM, it should be fairly straight forward to market campaign a title with a legacy like that. And regarding the "millions", I think Bethesda/id Software has the resources to manage that part...

Also games with "realistic" weapons are far more accessible in general. Every idiot knows what a pistol is, a sniper and an assault rifle. You can get a random person from the street and show him/her CS and he/she would understand at least 90% of the concept of the game immediately. And I guess war never gets boring.

1. Overwatch is popular and doesn't have "realistic weapons". So that point is voided.

2. Quake has for years been complimented as a spectator game exactly for bed theing intuitive, so that is kinda ironic. In duel you have two guys trying to shoot each other an one with most frags after 10 mins wins. More intuitive than the intricacies of CS.

3. Quake is a game which is likewise themed on "war" or violence is it not?

Which does not mean that the advertisement wasn't required to get it going in the first place.

Yes advertisement is what brought attention of the games to the masses, but that wasn't the point of discussion. It was the gameplay, which is the very thing that keeps them playing the game.

And as you write yourself, it offers something in terms gameplay that appeals to the current generation of gamers

Yes it does, which is why I used it as an example... It sounds like you wanted that to be a point that somehow supported your argument?

Implying that it isn't fun and implying the same for Diabotical.

I said not fun for new players. If Quake Live was fun for new players, they would have stayed after the steam release. id noticed that too and tried to make the game better accessible for new players, but in a very clumsy way (loadouts..).

If Diabotical manages to reproduce the near-perfect balance that Quake Live has while probably using mostly the same set of weapons and similar maps - my question is what is the big difference that puts Diabotical above Quake Live in terms of attracting and keeping new players?

It was the gameplay, which is the very thing that keeps them playing the game.

You say it yourself, what can I even add? Gameplay is what matters in the end. And if Quake gameplay was appealing to today's gamers, then more people would be playing Quake Live.

1. Overwatch is popular and doesn't have "realistic weapons". So that point is voided.

Logical fallacy. Hans kills a man. I am a human being. I did not kill a man. Hence, Hans is not a human being.

2. Quake has for years been complimented as a spectator game exactly for bed theing intuitive

Ok now it is getting ridiculous. TDM streams were even criticized by quake fans for being hard to follow and in duel you have to understand at least the basics of items and weapons.

Isn't Quake a big title which has a great legacy?
...
3. Quake is a game which is likewise themed on "war" or violence is it not?

Yes QUAKE got a guy with a cigar and gore, not robots that look like fucking walking eggs and cute sound effects. And yes Bethesda got money. Different game, far more possibilities to make a successful game.

If Quake Live was fun for new players, they would have stayed after the steam release.

Or it was old players that had put the game aside years ago who suddenly saw it on, installed it and put it away like they had done before. There wasn't advertisement campaign or the like to push Quake to the masses, so no new following was really introduced.

The same issues about Quake were still present. No modern surrounding infrastructure to facilitate match making, leagues, cosmetics and the like. So how can you then conclude that it is the gameplay which is lacking and incompatible with newer players, rather than these issues? You seem to totally disregard such factors in your calculations.

It is among other stuff such surrounding features, which would be present in Diabotical, and which we were screaming for in Quake Live but never saw.

Gameplay is what matters in the end. And if Quake gameplay was appealing to today's gamers, then more people would be playing Quake Live.

As I just mentioned above; gameplay is not the only factor, and I never said that it was the only factor. It might have gone completely over your head, back earlier in this discussion when I brought up the example of CS:GO. The whole reason why I mentioned that game, was because the example of an old game which were provided a graphical facelift and had a bunch of community features implemented around it...

Logical fallacy

Are you fucking kidding me? We were discussing whether or not a game with non-realistic weapons could become POPULAR, and you actually then think its argumentum ad populum to point to a popular game, which does contain such weapons, as an example?

Besides that, your Hans scenario doesn't even begin to describe the ad populum fallacy. If I had argued something to be true, merely because the majority would agree with me, then I would have committed the ad populum fallacy,

TDM streams were even criticized by quake fans for being hard to follow and in duel you have to understand at least the basics of items and weapons.

I will concede that. I was only thinking about 1v1 and was thus only arguing for that.

Yes QUAKE got a guy with a cigar and gore, not robots that look like fucking walking eggs and cute sound effects

So now we are back to where it began, which was about the aesthetic. You say that the style will deter people because it is too cutesy, while I don't really see that as an issue at all.

And yes Bethesda got money. Different game, far more possibilities to make a successful game.

I obviously do not argue that it will be the case. It is taken in context of discussing Quake, so why do you even bring that up?...

Or it was old players that had put the game aside years ago who suddenly saw it on, installed it and put it away like they had done before. There wasn't advertisement campaign or the like to push Quake to the masses, so no new following was really introduced.

While it was not advertised by Bethesda itself, the game certainly got attention by TotalBiscuit and the like featuring it. It is an interesting theory though but I am not sure if it would make the situation for arena fps better if it was true.

We were discussing whether or not a game with non-realistic weapons could become POPULAR,

No, I said that "games with "realistic" weapons are far more accessible in general". From that does not follow that a game with non-realistic weapons cannot become popular. I try to write down things the way I mean them, otherwise discussions become really confusing.

So now we are back to where it began, which was about the aesthetic.

War and violence sells in video games. QC will most likely make use of that, while Diabotical has to make up for that with something else. Which is possible of course, but personally I think it needs more artistic skill to reach the same level of satisfaction that a player gets from plastering his opponent's body all over the map.

I obviously do not argue that it will be the case. It is taken in context of discussing Quake, so why do you even bring that up?...

You brought it up: "Isn't Quake a big title which has a great legacy? [...] I think Bethesda/id Software has the resources to manage that part..."

------------------------------------------------------------------

Anyway.. the interesting part is this:

The same issues about Quake were still present. No modern surrounding infrastructure to facilitate match making, leagues, cosmetics and the like.

Quake Live is not that bad. It looks decent for what it is, has a proper interface, basic tutorials and at least a rudimentary skill-matching system. And it got stats and awards. I certainly agree that most of these points could be drastically increased, but are they really a game-changer for a new player? I guess that cannot be answered with 100% certainty unless we actually see Diabotical in the wild, doing its thing.

If I had to make a bet about Diabotical and QC though, they will both cut down certain parts of Quake (or make them optional, at least). One part is the movement. Strafe-jumping is completely counter-intuitive and makes no sense to someone who did not grow up with Quake. Diabotical might go with a Xonotic-like movement (I remember James talking positively about that approach in Reborn times), i.e. you keep the jump-key pressed and start bunnyhopping around, that combined with dash and double jumps to add variety. QC will probably have certain heroes that make strafe-jumping obsolete, while having other heroes to keep the old crowed satisfied.

Another point is the complexity of the items and weapons. I don't know how yet but I am quite sure that both games will either reduce it or take the player by the hand to avoid confused or frustrated newbies.

So if I am positive I would say yes, they will both be great and popular games. But Quake Live will still be known as the best arena fps out there when it comes to skill and depth.

In any case it is pretty exciting to see where this is going and hopefully we end up with two playable and fun new arena fps, whatever they might look like.

I don't know anything about UT so I can't comment but why would you ever assume that Reflex, a worse version of a game that appeals to a niche of a niche, would ever be bursting with players? Dota 2 is pretty much proof that casual players (retards) will play a good, hard game so long as there is sufficient infrastructure surrounding it (ie matchmaking, tutorials, COSMETICS, fun aesthetics) so I think you're way off in claiming that Diabotical is going to be dead on arrival.

If anything I think Quake Champions won't have much of a lifespan given that it's developed by a huge corporation and to make even small changes or improvements or respond to feedback requires dealing with huge amounts of red tape in order to make sure that shareholders don't get upset.

Well for starters the game seems to have infrastructure that id refused to even attempt to implement in QL for the entirety of the game's existence

Why do you assume that players need to leave one game in order to play another?

Is that what you do?

I have not a single gamer friend that only plays one game. I play Overwatch, I play Quake Live, I play League of Legends and I play Starcraft 2 because they are all good games so I'm not sure what you are getting at.

This is not Blizzard trying to find a market niche and spending 100 million dollars in targeting a certain audience.

The Kickstarter requested a low amount of money. I'm almost ashmed to admit it but the amount they requested is roughly my yearly salary so it's basically nothing in terms of funding a game like this. So it's not like a big company having everything on the line on this one game.

So I don't get your analysis or point at all. They are a bunch of passionate gamers, creating what they believe is the best possible afps game and also including tools to change the game (create whatever game for casual gamers you want) and social features.

Why would you even think of extremes like "who is going to uninstall Overwatch for this"?

Do they have to create a game for that purpose?

If they get 50k players then that's enough. How many bought Overwatch, 15 million?

How many play Call of Duty? How many play Battlefield?

You don't think there aren't enough players willing to install one more game like this without uninstalling their other game?

I know, we all love James but let's be a bit realistic.

130k is a joke, it means that you can pay one fulltime developer for around 60-70k. For one year. Or two part time developers, for one year.

So "including tools to change the game (create whatever game for casual gamers you want)" means more or less: we don't have the budget to deliver a lot of content, let the community do it by themselves.

"Uninstalling" was not meant literally. We all have a limited amount of time to spend on video games and it is good for you that you earn 100k and still have time to play (and get decent at?) 4 major titles at once. If I want to be halfway competitive at a game (that is what eSports are about, right?), I have to focus on a single game. Maybe I could handle two games if I stopped doing sports and other side activities.

And please stop that "best possible afps" thing before we don't at least have a playable beta. There are other damn good arena fps and adding a couple of social features and a map editor to yours doesn't automatically make it the very best arena fps ever.

they should collect them

they had their chance

+ reflex will /should stay as cpm/pm1 game

no heroes but full aircontrol pew pew pew LASER

I guess, anyone who would want to try competetive FPS with proper features.
1999 is long gone.

people who own a mouse and keyboard and can discuss said hardware for longer then 5 minutes ;)

I think we get an idea about that if we map out the new shooters from casual to hardcore/competitive:

Overwatch -- Quake:Champignons -- Diabotical -- Reflex

So it's a healthy middle ground, probably a bit more comp. than QC is gonna be. How I came up with this is, which audiences the respective games are able to reach with marketing/word-of-mouth/reddit posts etc. Which people you have a realistic chance to reach (which is mainly a function of your marketing budget and names/brands) determines how you should do development. Overwatch and QC both probably have six-digit marketing budgets and can reach millions, and inherently these millions of people will be casuals. So both Overwatch and QC are games appealing to that audience (Overwatch does it with tits and pixaresque short movies, QC apparently does it with action scenes or whatever). The actual gameplay mechanics of both of those are largely irrelevant. Diabotical seems to be more for the people who actually like to play videogames, the fact that the game is made by 2GD gives it a shitton of free marketing to those people (and obviously especially Dota players, and there are many of those). The mechanics of that game actually matter as a determinator of its success, and will be reminiscent of older titles, and geared towards fun, and letting people come up with new gamemodes and shit (kinda like other popular titles). I feel it's going to be the rocket league of First person shooters. Visitors of a website like ESR still call that casuals, and that's largely correct from our perspective.

SeemsGood

OpieOP //

OpieOP

<3

Already looks much better than Q:C.

This needs to be majored. Love the community hub concept :)

what if the game isn't playable on a CRT?

got a benq xl2411

noooooooo

Same, i think that is what will push this game into god mode.

i hope the kickstarter money lets them deliver on everything they promise.
because so far, of course, its only talk and ideas.

people in several comment threads all seem to get hyped way too easily imo. you read stuff like "already more polished than reflex" or whatever, when thats obviously not the case.

so far theres one nice looking deathmatch map and a map editor.
considering how the baseline kickstarter goal is for the game, and the two stretchgoals are for "relative" low-work-intensive additions to the game, my first thought when reading about community hubs, is that these hubs soound like a nice 200.000gbp stretch goal.. because that sure as hell isn't as trivial as adding in a race mode or whatever.

You need to watch them more closely I feel. The co-op survival goal is achievable but as he said in his diabotical KS update they only have two part-time workers on it. Achieving that goal would make it possible for the GD Studio to hire them full time and we're talking about atleast 9 months of full-time paid job for two developpers.

I guess their two employees are currently working part-time for co-op race and the 30k bonus would make it possible for the GD Studio to pay them for almost a year with full time jobs. That makes perfect sense.

The community hub is probably one of their biggest challenge and I'm pretty sure it's all part of the initial goal. I don't think it is undoable. In his update #1 vod you can see how pretty far it already is in terms of integrating stuff in the game (twitch vods/twitch chat) and they're looking to have their map editor finished in two months time.

Sure they have a lot of work and coding to do before it all comes together but that vod was reassuring and I like where they're going so far.

i feel like youre basically on the same page with what i wrote, you just put it more nicely.

im not as optimistic about the update tho, i only saw a new map, an animated gif on the wall, and either another animated gif, or video/mp4. it was basically a conceptart/mockup of things to come.

i wish youre right about the community hub, but i can see that eating up a ton of dev time.

don't get me wrong, i am hugely hyped about the game, and wish it the best. i'm just trying to manage my expectations.

for example: if we get to see the beta maybe in the end of this year, theres 6 months left for them to deliver the whole package(according to their plan atm). so if we see a full fledged fps game in december or january, with everything in it (netcode, art, mapeditor, gameplay) - i mean the whole base game coding done - then maybe i'd think they can manage the community-hub with 6 months left.. huge maybe, its not like they are all coders. my guess is 2 or 3 coders are on the team

i don't even know the whole scope of the community hub deal, but from what i've read it's at least this:
-ladders (+regional ladders) /stats whatever
-tournaments
-kind of ingame hub chatroom things where you can alternatively jump into a map of some kind to get a more immersive experience
-better twitch integration than any game befor
-workshop integration or something similar (this is a guess, but its become kind of standard)

You're right, we're basically on the same page but I'm the half full and you're the half empty cup on this one.

Ah well, it must be James' sweet wordings that got to me. Some of what he said and some of what we know was reassuring that it wasn't so far fetched though :

- Twitch and Diabotical = HTML5 (although beta for twitch)
- James has been with Twitch for ages now and will surely get a ton of help and support from them

Also, what we know about Diabotical :

Physics / Gameplay / Movement is about almost done. I'm pretty sure that whole area will be almost entirely covered by the time the map editor is done, since it will also means that the modding part of the game that includes physics, movement, weapons will be done. Maybe some more designs, sounds will have to be included in later on.

That basically means that apart from netcode and maps, there isn't that much to do yet in terms of gameplay (I feel). Before going into KS, James and The GD Studio have been working for years in order to deliver a pretty decent version of their game already. Which we can see in the gameplay trailer on their page.

Done.

Didn't really like the idea that it was CPMish movement but it's looking pretty cool actually.

Gotta admit, Diabotical is increasingly becoming more interesting than Quake Champions.

Very good ideas and plans, going to be supporting diabotical as much as I can. It looks really good.

I had my doubts. but, this looks pretty minted :)

Already backed, and will enjoy playing it, this i already know =p

Community hub , it is awesome .

How about having text beeing displayed over theyr heads , small bubble. You can choose if you want your text be shown over your head.

Your rankings "elo" is also displayed so people can tell from distance.

"any1 1v1?"

Then you can approach him, and within a set distance, you can chat more private with the person and challenge him for a duel and join same server .

All without having them ever on your own friendslist .

This would actually make the community hub have more of a purpose .

Could be 1v1\4v4\ca hubs , or specific areas on the map where 1v1 players hang out etc

Want to get friends, challenge for duels or just hang out , community hubs .

After QL steam release i have almost no friends in QL and its sad :\ hardly ever get to play a duel, just ffa . I want community hub ! =p

Or this can be the gayest thing ever, considering it will be occupied by 99.999% men :P

I really like the idea about finding duels by jumping around and being able to see player's MMR above their head. It is just a nice little feature which would make a more immersive game world. It could of course be combined with various other more classical methods of searching for opponents, without detracting from the process.

Clanwars could fast become eggbot stare downs with 8 or more clanmates opposing each other and talking shit during match arrangements while a mob of spectators encircle the players, cheering and stuff. Could be pretty entertaining in itself :P

My thoughts exactly. Community hub is such a cool concept. We are all used to jumping around in warmup and chatting anyways :D.

THIS

edit: I also think there should be a 'social' section within the game kinda like how Overwatch has done it. With a built in voice chat, then you can join a voice chat group with friends you've added. This would be really helpful especially for team games.

Hah , and with the text beeing displayed , you can stand on a box , and start preaching . Hoping for followers to flock around you , and you can talk about your amazing quake skills and how it is needed for higher level in real life .

Quake jesus , only in Diabotical :P

Just backed on kickstarter.

I would like to see a q4 style tournament system. 16 players put into a bracket and the games all take place at the same time.

Fans wont be happy if its meant to be streamed, otherwize i agree.

Not for the big tournaments, more as a casual thing that you can just join at any time. Click join tournament then you get put in a lobby until there's the desired amount of people.

Would work very well with the community hub idea too.

Not sure how it worked in Bloodline Champions, but James has already talked about their automatic tournament system from that game, which they will implement here in Diabotical as well.

BLC GUI was so cluttered no one could find the tournaments menu and game died.

The name is utterly terrible, but the game itself looks pretty awesome. These eggbots are really hilarious.

Yep, i like it, man this community hubs will be awesome.

ewww wtf is this

weapons are amazing !

I'm gonna need some picmipped shaft. Pls.

Yeah, need cg_lightningstyle 5.

you guyz are gona be pissed when we realize qc will have locked gfx :DDDD

Don't.......... =(

damn glad & happy i backed it with 42€

[2nd battlerite + diabotical gonna get a old q3 dude "loxx" that brought me 2 Q3 ~2002 >_< ]

{ my first game i kickstarted}

2nd was shadow of collosus thingy = "Prey for the Gods" thought will come out december 2016 not 2017 ^^

this will be good game

another game, which nobody will play.

look at reflex.

but hey, lets make even more of them and hype 'em! ;)

Fixed for you (made some slight adjustments):

another game, which already has more following than reflex without even public access to it, that people will play.

look at reflex.

but hey, the hype is justified, good on 'em! ;)

It's not like anyone on this site cares to see Reflex succeed. Seems to me 95% have enjoyed watching Reflex's limited popularity.

I don't think that's true. There are a few vocal people that wish death upon anything they dislike on this. However, I believe most people either don't care or hope for a success that may help revive the genre.

Well they've been quite silent while everyone else piles on the hate train to hatersville.

That's how internet works really.

Reflex's kickstarter brought like 1/10 of the content that Diabotical is showing. Reflex brings nothing new to the genre and has a total player base of like 10 people.

What does Diabotical bring other than non-gameplay features like hubs and aesthetics? Seems like it has all the same gameplay mechanics as previous AFPS games - same weapons, strafe jumping of some sort, double jumps, etc.

Haven't we sort of (among our 100% biased website) kinda decided that gameplay wise we pretty much have what we want? At least, we have what we think we want.

It's the dressing up of the game all pretty and modern that we need

Lol, yup

Diabotical will bring the most important feature to any multiplayer game, more people to play against. 2GD's fans span across different esport titles so his audience will have a longer staying power while Quake champions will only have 13 year olds play for 1 month and leave.

Why do you restrict the question to 'new mechanics'? I think arena fps are fine when it comes to core mechanics and gameplay. Where they are lacking if you ask me is the meta layer, which includes everything that makes you want to go back to the game and something you regularly think about. And that's exactly where stuff like hubs, content creation, etc. fall into.

See the comment I was replying to. The implication is that Reflex has/plans nothing new and Diabotical does. If that's what he's saying, then it certainly makes no sense as far as features go since Reflex already has a multiplayer map editor with themes (just like Diabotical plans to have) and built-in Lua scripting functionality, and plans for many other features. Let's keep in mind that 2GD can promise the world (so can Reflex) but there seems to be in aeoL's comment an assumption that only Diabotical will deliver.

I can agree about the details of what the games have in terms of features, but what aeol is saying is a perception that many people have. I think that's mostly down to communication and visibility, which is an area where 2GD has a strong advantage over Reflex Devs. But before you call all this bullshit, think of the fact that the next Quake will attract immediately all Quakers with its name alone.

I guess I'm a believer in, "if you build it, they will come". Be focused rather on making an excellent game rather than on superficiality. We've all seen games that have a superficial appeal for one reason or another but when people find out it's actually not that much fun, it rapidly loses players.

2GD certainly has a lot more popularity and in that respect he has an advantage over Reflex which has relied more on the vocal community to market the game and encourage people to play it. The question is really whether 2GD can parlay the advantage he has to actually make a good game. He has a lot more resources out of the gate. Let's hope they're used wisely and not wasted on things for superficial reasons.

What you say (quality brings success) is true only if you are the first. Once a bunch of alternative products exist, quality alone does not bring you anywhere far. Afaik, that's true for any product out there and games are not different. The name quake holds so much power that quake champions starts miles ahead of any competitor, and if it does not suck substantially, it will be the game most of us will play, even against clear evidence of competitors being better products.

If anything, reflex failed at presenting itself as something quakers should care about and believe in. I've never heard a strong convincing vision of what the ecosystem of that game would be. Cool game features, but what about the rest? What is going to win our hearts? I'm not sure that what 2GD is presenting will be enough to win the community (I think a lot will depend on the timing of release and whether qc fails), but for sure focusing on just making a better core game would be suicide. The proof is, there are already better clients and better core ruleset than QL, yet they have no players.

gogo 2gd, u still have a chance to destroy q champs and shitwatch :) just...dont F U C K it U P

Mentioned leaderboards, didn't mention anticheat.

*grabs popcorn*

get used to it. valve/blizzard only ban publicly available cheats, they dont want to spend more money hiring some prodigy that can deal with the private cheats eventhough they have $millions at hand. diaboticals small team with limited funds can only do so much.

Imagine the witch hunts done inside the community hubs! We could even build proper courts, and attendees could throw rotten veggies at those found guilty. This is evolution.

The walk of shame!

enough of the quake clones.... we demand a painkiller clone !

a damn fine game it was SP+even MP [ the FIRST ]

stake gun still alive @ reflex

doom 2016 = painkiller mod

Too quick for you now old man :)

Almost reached the 150.000 pound goal for survival co-op....