first.. also lost-cause is pretty good for a black guy

whats that for racist comment? jezus

i think he was joking... you know as in "haha"...

its what i like to call "a joke"

BLACKS IN GOVT.

It's what I like to call ignorant.

I'm not sure what's worst, making racist jokes or the people on this site making such a big deal out of them when most can't go 2 minutes without calling someone a fag or some other derogative term and thinking it's ok.

damn dude, you just went up in my book (ur still somewhere at the bottom tho ;p)

a [+] for you

I still say the best thing to come from Belgium is the "buns" and "van damme"!

Have you ever seen CCCP-Bios play? I rest my case.

Please rest your big fat American ass too.

Racism doesnt just apply to minoritys as you have just shown

Racism applies to any race amazingly!

But no countries.

yeah your right, my bad, hes stereotyping, which is as bad... if the bloke wasnt american that is.

Typical Brit to get that sort of thing wrong...

I'm not stereotyping, I'm insulting. Which I think is prrrrreeeety reasonable judging from the remark he made.

not that i actually care anyways... but do you know the bloke in person? if not, you used a pretty common stereotype of americans that there all fat, which of course there not.

Dont you think its slightly hypocritical to say that because he supposedly made a 'rasist' remark. In fact, who really gets pissed off with comments like that? Plus your actually highligting the fact you find it racist and choose to make a big deal about it. Seriously if everyone used the word nigger all the time and had a good laugh about it the word would have no meaning anymore.

White people suck at athletics!!!

Ironically the longest triple jumper in the world is white (Jonathan Edwards-uk). Who says white men can't jump!

hah, i didnt know that :D

You're a retard. Talk to me again when you've learned how to write "racist".

officer mc.dickhole from the special spelling controll squad here...

Whats the matter? lost the argument? dont bother replying your on ignore, KTATHXBB

How is it funny?

I'll have to agree with Jamerio for once : how often are there homophobic jokes and the like here and nobody reacts ?

Thats because "politically correct'" is a multi-standard term tailor made to make people feel better about themselves And its also one of the most hypocritical inventions ever.

<3 eri

right on!

I reply about happyness to those comments from time to time also, but there are so much of it.

Here though I just wondered how it was funny as I don't get it.

some call it black humour.

[+]

Nuke

nuke yourself
off the face of the earth, preferrably.

lost-cause is the tiger woods of pro-gaming

And Mojo's the John Daley.

john daley wins

Bernard manning, alive and fat in good ole u.s of arse!

hahahahaha loLOLOL



idiot

BLACK?!?!?!!? DID YOU SAY... B L A C K???
OMfGOSH RACISM HE IS AN AFRICAN AMERICAN!!111111

use of the word black is acceptable...

OMG and now another one, the world is turning racist man =(

smrat u r

ggs though lostcause should have won :<

uhh, he didn't. so, no, no he shouldn't have.

quit hating bitch

Quit bitching hate!

it's called reality, bunny honey

"With the exception of MOJO, they both proceeded through the tournament playing the best of what North America, China, and the Netherlands has to offer"

ahahahah ouch

Isn't anyone else concerned that demos still havent been released? CPL Winter demos were released as the tournament went along. Myabe i'm just worried that the top players will keep the tradition of keeping demos secret going :(

awesome games! nice play by lost-cause..u own!! stermys rail was just badass :P

next time ull beat him lc!

can't wait to see what happens at CPL Summer although im afriad ill fall asleep watching stermy vs toxic on galang playing instagib, really looking foward to see how lost-cause plays against the dreamhack players such as fooki/toxic/cooller

also:
For placing 4th, Fatal1ty won a Fatal1ty-XFI soundcard
I really hope someone gets a picture of when he recieves his prize

yeah, i wanna see a pic too :)

I'm looking forward to see a decent stream.

And a coverage better than posting scores.

the last time i remember a decent stream from an esports event was cpl summer 2005, so don't count much decent coverage, except some scores

ESWC 2005 was also very nice ;) And CPL WT Finals.

buy a connection the stream was fine

Not for all obviously. I experienced anything from two perfect streams (both DH and LW at the same time) to none working at all.

Don't tell me 2mbps DSL is not fine for a stream...

My connection was fine but I couldn't get anything on the stream. I have 2Mb dsl at home, nothing but breaking audio and a new video frame every 5 minutes. At both of my gaming centres I pay around €500 a month for 4Mb surestream connection and still absolutely nothing on the stream apart from breaking audio. I'm guessing that they have the cheapest possible routing so that most people can't connect properly to the streams.

yea i noticed i should take backl my comment.

There was this link for windows media player classic that worked flawless foreveryone that had buffer problems. Like me too.

I tried the direct link to the stream, rather than the website or was there something else?

This was the link

mms://tetris.tsncentral.com/channel2?MSWMExt=.asf

yeah ,that one was working perfectly for me.
wmplayer ,60 sec buffer.

Wish I knew that 3 days ago :).

what's a substream connection?

'SureStream', think that's just what they call the Internet service they provide us.

god, misreading everything lately!

https://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1114916

Erm whats the meaning of man-whore competition ? :/

and who won?! i want pics

phrantic most played map and they remove it, something just isnt right there :|

agreed...

I was mentioning how is it going to be like watching a finals on Fool's Run versus all the great matches that have been had on Phrantic.

Whatever the "pros" or wannabe's say about how Phrantic plays... it's spectator appeal is without question. I'd much rather see a fast paced game between two top players on Phrantic than a sniper-fest on a rail map.

I'm sure if you check the stats of any tourney played to this date, Phrantic is the most chosen map.

Yes but I suspect Phrantic is the most choosen because...

It does not have a rail. I think you'll see Man called Son (damn name!) becoming the new Phrantic.

Problem with that is if the new CPL committee rules become the norm, each player is entitled to eliminate one map before the match starts. A rail player will obviously eliminate AMCS and that will make the entire match played on rail maps.

r4nger, we have revised that to coincide with the current way which is

1. Each player picks a map
2. If tied, each player throws out a remaining map.
3. Players play tiebreaker on remaining map that's left.

Imo it would be better to add 1 more map without rail (like phrantic that everony played) and keep the system whern you start by removeing 2 maps.

no.

pick first is the best system imo... it was used in Q3 ESWC and PK WT. We had a vote in the committee, and most of the top players agreed that was the best system.

wasent the vote that every player remove 1 map and then pick one? or did you change that.. or was i only stupid and miss read it all the first time.

"r4nger, we have revised that to coincide with the current way which is

1. Each player picks a map
2. If tied, each player throws out a remaining map.
3. Players play tiebreaker on remaining map that's left. "

That's how it is now. That's how it was in the good ol' Q3 days. That's how it should be.

Yeah, still think ther should be one more map without rail tho ;D. If 2 players wants to play 2 maps without rail they should be able to.

The originally posted one was much cooler though :D

Still think changing phrantic to man called son won't help anyone. If the people play the map, it definately shouldn't be map to remove.

You and Xeon should setup a phrantic appreciation society!!!!

Indeed.

Yeah it's kind of weird, I think phrantic should stay in and fool's run should be dropped.
Phrantic might have lots of problems and stuff but the games tend to be fun to watch and play wile fool's run is just boring and dumb=P

i agree with fools run but dont what u said about phrantic :D

yup

Thats becous "everyone" löööööööööööööövs the rail... or somthing =/

"most played map" doesn't mean it's the best / least random map =)

Most played map means that people like it. If people like to play it I don't see why it should be removed.

It's one of the easiest maps to play in my opinion. So I guess people choose it because they feel confident on it. That still doesn't mean the map is very good map from an objective point of view.

My best map in Q3 was pro-q3tourney4 and I would choose that in a tournament. Yet, from a more objective point of view, I think pro-q4tourney4 is a flawed map and that ztn3tourney1 is a much more well-balanced and diverse map.

true that, but pt4 aint still the map to be removed. A man called son aint just as good as phrantic to replace map without rail. btw I find galang much easier to play, just run from armor to armor and hit your rails and you do pretty well :P

I'm a rail whore, but I think galang is more complex strategically because it's harder to know where the opponent is. On phrantic you can basically see your opponent all the time which makes it much easier to make the right decisions. I don't have to put a lot of effort into calculating where my opponent will likely be, where he will come from etc. because it's so fucking obvious on that map =)

Also, Phrantic is too random. Like read the write-up on the last map between stermy and lost-cause:

"He continued this spree, determined to take the early lead with four quick kills..."

"Stermy managed to lure him into the red armor room with 2:30 left and lit him up, leading to three quick spawn kills and securing the victory as well as his victory at the first World Series of Video Games event."

Only on phrantic... :/

Ther is alot of spawn rapes on every map, more common on phrantic tho.

"Most played map means that people like it." thats only true to some extend. imho it also showes that many players dont want to face their opponent on a rail map.
but im kinday biased anyway because i hate phrantic, u have the same situations over and over again and u dont have many possbilities to vary.

nt lc

where are the demos... FFS
dreamhack demos of todays matches are already up......

Bigups for lc! WP!

For placing 4th, Fatal1ty won a Fatal1ty-XFI soundcard

lol brilliant ^^

I wonder if Fat was using his mouse (fatal1ty 1010) for this LAN...
Same with the other F-Players.

They wouldn't be using the 1010 that is out on the market because it's not good...fat is probably using the 2020.

Bet he's using his old ms exploror 3.0 aight

watch the pics, he using his mouse, mousepad and headset!

your prediction will be wrong!

I really wish he would make a public statement about the whole
thing...Have the integrity to stand by his brand, offer refunds.
Those kind of things inspire people to buy more of his stuff...
something along the lines of Blizzard cancel'ing a game that
they were working on for over 3 years (if I recall) , because
it didn't meet their standards. That's a sure fire way to
scoop up a lot of life long fans.

*shrug*

Maybe he felt that having a PR employee posting a statement on
his forums was enough.

Or maybe a company needs the kind of success and cash flow
that WC2 made for Blizzard, before they can afford to pull
such a cool stunt like that off. :-)

Or maybe I'm just "wool-gathering" in some kind of a Freudian
subconscious daze, because deep inside I feel this incredible
self loathing for falling for some cheap marketing...or maybe my
pills are kicking in as I type this...or maybe this is just me
procrastinating from q4 practice for a lan I'm going to in 5 days...
or maybe typing the phrase "or maybe" 49 times in a single
esr forum post is a secret way to magically enslave every person
that reads this...or maybe I'm trying too hard to be funny...or
maybe I just like to type...or maybe I can't wait to read somebody
replying to this post, with the words "Or Maybe You're Gay", or
maybe nobody will respond because I just said that...or maybe
the strange choppiness and utter insanity of not being able to
see the HUD of the painkiller demo I watched yesterday, has
completely destroyed my ability to resist adding even more or
maybe's to this post....or maybe or maybe...or maybe my WoW
character who's name is "Maybe" needs some Ore...
Or Maybe vs. Or Maybe might be the most awesome fight of this
century...Or maybe my name is Indigo Mantoya and you made me
forget about Father's day and therefore I highly recommend that
you prepare to die...

He's using Microsoft. I was there. Oh, and I got to try his mouse, and yes, it's horrible. :) Carry on.

I sat right behind him for almost every game. He was using a prototype version of the 2020, at no point did he ever use a microsoft mouse.

The only non fat thing he used the entire tourney were some headphones (sennheiser 280's I believe) that had a more noise cancelling design. The fact that the PA system was blasting "WELCOME TO THE WSVG PRESENTED BY INTEL" every five seconds pretty much forced him to.

lost-cause showed how good q4 can be, when you dont play rail-only

Yea, all we need now is: Stermy vs Toxic (instagib)
and then Lc vs Cooller (quality non rail based tactics)
I think it's a shame, (that now most of the top players seem to be REALLY getting there heads around q4) that the rail is the only weapon that still has a big problem, oh and the rl bug, errmm the sticky nades, oh yea, the net code. ah shit its all fucked, innit!

apparently you've never seen LoSt-CaUsE use the railgun.
we, in the central/eastern US, have.

What i'm sayin is, he's not "all rail"
How good he is with it is beside the point.

I know what you're saying, and it's completely idiotic.
stermy had amazing aim in Quake III as well, but was completely demolished by superior 'tacticians' routinely.
I hope you're not insinuating that stermy would have no skill without the railgun, because the games would have resulted in a similar fate I'd wager.

both players have good tactics and that sort of thing.
and LoSt-CaUsE can, has, and does play the all-aim fare. he may have changed his game, I don't know. (I deleted Quake IV)
but both players are capable of playing that way and adjusting if necessary, and both players are capable of using (note to shoutcasters and just idiots in general: USING, NOT UTILIZING) strategy and tactics.
stermy was the better player and won.

it's not like LoSt-CaUsE couldn't defeat stermy if it were all rail or all anything-else.
as a matter of fact, I played a washed out LoSt-CaUsE (yes, he was a very good player well before Quake IV - in fact he played top 20 in Babbage's or something like that, IIRC) on pro-q3dm6 last year and was only beaten 11-0 or less (I think that was actually my friend hexstatic's score against him, and it was 5-2 or something against me before LoSt-CaUsE had to leave).
everyone who has a little bit of experience is on a level playing field when they aren't familiar with new maps or new styles of play.

LoSt-CaUsE came a very long way to up his playing ability to the necessary level, and I think he's probably pretty happy with the results, though he probably would have preferred to have won the game that is or isn't in question.

so I guess what I'm saying is that both of them (LoSt-CaUsE and stermy) know the game, both have experience, and both are very well capable of playing either style. (again, I have witnessed LoSt-CaUsE doing the rail rape in Q3)
if it happens that LoSt-CaUsE tried to play a more tactical game, then I guess he didn't do what was necessary for the victory, and that's why he didn't get it and doesn't deserve it. (the only time the winner doesn't deserve the win is when he lost!!! I mean cheated)

Get your head out your arse, and read what i wrote.

ok. which part are you having trouble with?

totally aggre

Thats not the point.

Everyone use the rail now and then, it is the best long ranged weapon in the game. The problem is that the rail is so powerfull that you see som players useing it all the time ( this is not a problem if you dont like to watch/play realy heawy games).

If you wher to show 1000 random peapols 2 games, 1 beeing a rail heawy Galang and the other map beeing a fast paced Phrantic i bett you most of them would say that Phrantic wher the most fun to watch (i cant prove this, and i could be wrong.. but i dont think that if you dont realy know q4 you are not going to watch a 15 min sneak around rail battle).

Quake (as a game series) isent played the way som players play Q4 (might be for som of you). Quake in my world is a fast game wher players bunny jump around (the thing that made quake quake) and fight it out like gladiators.

Som games look like a CS match. 1 player is sneaking around in slowmotion waiting for his AWP... Rail shot, and if the other player moves around to much it ends with him dieing from rail hits (like Stermy vs L-C on galang..).

PK was fun to watch, CPMA is fun to watch and OPS is fun to watch, becous ther is movement in those game, you dont see that many "im going to wait in this pos with the rail for 15 secs and then move to my new pos and wait ther for 15 sec" games ther.

Dont get me wrong with this post, the players that are "railwhores" are not in anyway bad players, its just that they are dead boring to watch.

good reply, but i want to add me opinion about the rail heavy style.
i wouldnt want to play against someone who just focuses on the rail, but i dont think it is boring to watch. i like to see different playing styles so i dont think that its boring to have some players that focus on rail more than others.

@ all the instagib vs tactics whiners: remember stermy won the final by winning phrantic

I know he won phrantic, and im not saying he dosent have alot of skills.

The point is that ther wher 2 sets of Bo3, and they wher both wery close games... except for Galang that ended with 30+ score on stermys side. I could be wrong, but it was the rail that made that score on galang (that and the fact that L-C moved around the map... bad misstake).

It could be that L-C suck ass on Galang (i doubt it), but i think it has somthing to do with the map beeing a bit to rail friendly.

I have no problem with that som players play the game rail heavy, but the trend in q4 is that more and more players are going for the rail (even when you play agains randoms on pub servers everyone tend to railwhore, its easy and it gets you the fraggs).

I think somthing is wrong when every map is tight as hell, but the rail map then ends 30+ - 5. No weapon should be so powerful on a map imo.

btw: the phrantic thing of my reply wasnt directed as u (thats why i wrote an "@all the instagib vs tactics whiners" infront)

actualy i can just agree with u that the railwhore trend in q4 is bad in general (and that it is kinda easy)

im not sure though if galang is more rail dependent than monsoon for example. but galang is more "spread out" and thus favors the static corner rail play... hmm hard to explan what i mean ;)

Yeah i kinda unsterstod that :D, but it was a nice reply to elaborate even more what i think about the rail heavy play in Q4.

Monsoon isent as railfriendly as galang becous of the 35sec mega and the 50 healt. Ther is more HP and Arrmor on tha map, so its way easyer to eat a rail and still be in the game.

I agree. There's only one exception: toxic is fun to watch ;). The problem with the railgun in Quake 4 is that because of the clunky movement (kind of like Doom 3 but only with crcouchsliding and some strafejumping) it's hard to avoid getting shot. Although many people whined about the railgun in Quake 3 too, the gun is a lot more unbalanced in Qu4ke.

that brings us back to the question->
what's fun to watch, and what's fun/skilled to play

games of phrantic can be really frustrating with the high level of spam and spanwrape and games of galang/monsoon be more strategic and less frustrating becuase its a lot less random

You are 100% right.

Thats why games like OSP, CPMA and other games are so fun to watch. Everyone have ther style, and it works kinda well for most of them.

It feels like every event turns more and more rail heawy in Q4. So if we want a game that is realy fun to watch for everyone (and we want that dont we?) We might need to change somthing so everyone can find somthing nice to see :D.

I dont like rail battles that much, so i liked Fatal1tys and L-C's games the most, som peapols love rail fights so naturaly they are going to like Stermy's games.

It would suck if Q4 eveolved even more toward the rail, so peapol like me and som others would lose the thing we find nice to see in the game, the same way it would suck if they removed the rail fights, so other peapol would lose the thing they think is fun.

Stermy vs Toxic (instagib)

they should do that! \o/

that would be a cakewalk for stermy.

So you're saying Stermy would do well after he is intoxicated?

*stares blankly...wondering wtf fortress is talking about*

It's a pun using the name 'Toxic'.

/me is slow

Where can I see how much they earned?

FINAL STANDINGS

1. stermy - $5000
2. tek9.LoSt-CaUsE - $2,500
3. coL.socrates_ - $1,500
4. Fatal1ty - Creative X-Fi soundcard (!)
5. x6-cha0ticz - Creative X-Fi soundcard

Danke

Lost-cause is without a doubt the coolest looking Quake4 pro player =D

then you haven't seen me



oh wait, I don't play Q4 ;<

did fatal1ty win a fatal1ty sound card or a shitty extreme music edition?

how is the xtrememusic edition shitty? it's the exact same thing except the fatal1ty one comes with x-ram that no games even support. i'd say the fatal1ty one is the shitty version since it is ridiculously overpriced and has his logo stamped on it.

Q4 (and D3 with a patch that comes with the card) and BF2 supports it at least. I think there are more now actually, this was when it first came out.

Q4 supports XRAM? since when? the only game i've heard supports it is BF2.

it doesnt come with a 5.25 inch drive bay panel either!
It was jk though, I wanted to know if Fal1ty won a fatal1ty card because that is funny, but if he won a xtreme card that is just sad.

good post this is what i call good coverage

happy to see someone play who can aim with rail - lc had some good ones of his own

damn nt lc, going through what you did, you had to be tired and played out.

stermy!

good win, shame all the good players are at dreamhack though ;P

You clearly forgot he beat socrates...

who?

> ...shame all the good players are at dreamhack...

LIES

;)

not entirely true, forever and stermy were present xD

They wouldn't finish above any of the top6 maybe even top12(Although I'm less confident about that!)

The level of play at Dreamhack is far greater. Watching Lanwar they were literally running into rails, shaft, rockets left right and centre. Their use of spam to control their opponent was far worse and their dodging ability didn't seem to be too great in comparison.

I don't think so , Tim

nice to watch and stermy wasnt waiting in one position with rgh most of the time he was going around the map was fun to watch.

Rafik, aka lost-cause[er33t], way to go my friend.

only reason why phrantic is being played so much, is cuz believe it or not, it's the best that q4 has to offer, and fun part is most ppl want this map to be removed from the playlist, funny scene,

RIP Q4, <3 Warsow

well atleast Q4 dosent have a scene that enters EVERY thread about other games and post about how much Q4 owns and how much every other game sux ass (or IRC channels for that mather).

So imo we have a kinda fun scene.

you are being pathetic, just cuz i mentioned <3 warsow, grow up boy, and read the rest what i said, instead of commenting on one little detail, maybe i use to play q4 before stopping for warsow, ever thought about that smarteypants?

<3 WARSOW
<3 WARSOW
<3 WARSOW

this'll probly hurt ur feelings, cuz this time the whole comment is about <3 warsow, unlike the one before

ps: yes i am adapting (goin down) to ur level
ps2: this is the first time i mentioned <3 warsow in a comment ever, but i'll try to remember to do it again when ur around

this totaly owned palmen.
..if i where u palmen, i would run and hide.
;D

Hide.. nah its time to hang myself over this =(

aub kerel...

No it wont hurt my feelings, and it realy dosent bother me. I only find it kinda funny that almost every wSw player have the need to point out how much better ther game is then every other game out ther (and then say that other games have bad scene).

yeah, never seen a Q4 fan flaming PK... maybe a bad example since everyone flamed PK?

I loved PK, so it wasent me :D

now, we just have to wait for the WSVG INTERPLANETARY FINAL between Stermy and whoever wins Dreamhack to see who's the true champ!

omfg Playing CTF for er33t was so AWSOME. I remember the first night i joined and we won our first match in OT, I almost broke my desk. :D Where are you guys hiding? I have to come say hi!

Congrats for your awesome result. I remember you asking me some stuff about gaming champions at cpl summer while being high as a kite again...good stuff ;)
Well done, hope you continue your good play in quake4.

uhh, was your name still LoSt-CaUsE in er33t?

And yes it was. He only played a couple matches before disappearing to go play 1vs1's probably. If I remember correctly he played in the match where we beat Pm for #1 on OGL.

It's just gring0 and I in #er33t on etg.

Nice touch the facts bit.

People are ALL-RAIL when they get a chance to play on maps with open and large areas. Unfortunetaly most of the maps have this open areas and they are so widely ranged, that you can hit your enemy across the whole map with the railgun. As a result, it's quite easy to hold the map-lock due to those conditions. In my opinion, that's the main-reason, why Phrantic was chosen so much. Of course, Phrantic has wide ranges too, but it doesn't have a rail and with a steely discipline and I'm sure about that, any player can manage to play this map efficiently by pulling his enemy out of his line. Remember pro-dm6 ? Players without map-lock have sometimes waited about minutes in order to hope for an enemy's mistake (remember lexer vs chaotics qcon 2002?). It's obvious, if a player doesn't make any of them, he won't lose, but it's rather seldom, that any pro plays a 100 percent power-match. And since Quake4 is heading to his first anniversary, we don't have enormous tactical matches, cuz there is still a lot to discover. Therefor, players have to play more aggressive than they were used to in there former games and maps like Phrantic are, as somebody already said, fast-paced.

Interesting Facts:

The most played map, and the most common first choice was Phrantic


cpl bring back phrantic :/

like that matters much in a 3map mappool

"The most played map, and the most common first choice was Phrantic"

Good thing that map got the boot!

gg stermy...
i love you :)
we won't play galang anymore togheter lol

demos ffs

It boggle's my mind...why arn't they posted?
Do fans have to fly all around the world just to
be able to watch these amazing players in something
other than a horrible, tiny, highly compressed
stream with no option to turn the commentators
off while still retaining the in-game sounds?

([+] for longest run-on sentence ever plz)

wtf why was my name mentioned


ass.

Yeah, that pot shot at mojo was pretty harsh/uneccessary/bullshit but hey, what can you do.

GG lost cause u've come a long way!

We need the demos from lanwar. Having the demos is small step towards improving the q4 community. I know its a small step but its necessary.

Interesting Fact:

DEMOS ARE STILL NOT UP YET

more interesting fact:

THEY NEVER WILL BE!

even more interesting fact:

THERE WAS NO LANWAR AS WE DON'T HAVE ANY PROVEMENT

ps. BULLSHIT

i was jk jezus

LOL still no demos?!!

Demos were recorded and will be uploaded over the next couple of days. I believe the domain that was purchased for hosting those demos is www.wsvgcast.com - expect to see them going up!

are they up yet? :)

Oh, just as a warning - the WSVG admins realized after pulling the demos from the Q4 finals match that LoStCaUsE neglected to record his :( But Stermy's will be available.

For future referance, there is a server side command to force clients to record demos of matches. There is now also a command to automatically record server side demos (both players pov) with the new Q4Max (0.75).

...